Talk:Francesca Stavrakopoulou

Bible's Buried Secrets

Any idea what relationship there is between the 2011 BBC Two series "Bible's Buried Secrets" and the NOVA / PBS series The Bible's Buried Secrets? Somersetlevels (talk) 20:38, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Looking on the website for the PBS series and having seen two of the three episodes of Dr Stavrakopoulou's show they seem to substantial overlaps and even some of the same interviewees but they also seem clearly different. The BBC show has three episodes:

1. Did King David's Empire Exist? Doubts about how important David was!
2. Did God Have a Wife? Worshiping of the "wife" of god Asherah and likely generalised polytheism
3. The Real Garden of Eden ???

And Dr Stavrakopoulou is presenting and interviewing in all them and she is not in the PBS one. She also seems, to me anyway, to be presenting much of this stuff as her discoveries rather than as acting mostly as a conduit for the weight of recent scholarship. (Msrasnw (talk) 21:17, 24 March 2011 (UTC))

At no point does she claim these discoveries are hers. She states quite clearly she is presenting them. Regardless, the two series are not related other than in their subject. 03:01, 25 September 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.92.72.114 (talk)

I don't see any reason to delete the entry. Indeed, not only Dr Stavrakopoulou undermines monotheism. If you search for polytheism in Israel, you will find many documentaries supporting Francesca's claims. Many people will hate her ideas but I don't think it's a reason to stay close to her point of view.

Also, I don't see a reason why people should believe in somebody (David) whose existence is barely provable.

The Real Garden of Eden is a fascinating theory as well. I agree to final conclusions that the story influenced very deeply human minds. Let the article about Francesca stay. --78.145.203.240 (talk) 03:05, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Totally have a crush on her. I was impressed and slightly jealous that a program like this would be tolerated on the BBC, when here in America things have been so tilted in favor of Christian fundementalists that such programming would never fly. People promoting the Biblical narrative are featured in media all the time. She has as much a right to present the perspective of an analytical and unindoctrinated scholar of the Bible. And her work is certainly notable given the response to her. Ezdeath2.0 (talk) 23:29, 23 September 2011 (UTC)

Professor

Couldn't find "professor" in the article. This link says she's a professor of Hebrew Bible and Ancient Religion. Rursus dixit. (^mbork³!) 14:38, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

That link is to a self-published biographical entry—the article subject writing about herself—and can appear as a supporting source in the text, to corroborate facts established independent, third-party sources. We do not simply repeat statements people make about themselves. See WP:VERIFY. Le Prof Leprof 7272 (talk) 03:05, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

Professor?

Professor of what? Suitable for a show, but deeply inadequate for a serious scientific transmission.--Italo zamprotta (talk) 11:05, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

She's Professor of Hebrew Bible and Ancient Religion, and also Head of Department, at the Department of Theology and Religion at the University of Exeter, which is one of the most respectable theology and religion departments in the UK. 95.149.134.102 (talk) 15:26, 31 December 2014 (UTC)

Please see below; content is left in the article (Prof, Dept head), but it must be independently sourced, to ultimately remain (see WP:VERIFY). Le Prof Leprof 7272 (talk) 03:03, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

You are right to be cautious but I think you can rely on a university webpage to get the job title and academic rank of their staff correct.Martinlc (talk) 16:53, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

Edits of this date

The series of edits, removing twitter as a source, reformatting all sources to reFill or better template standards, and checking all material against the three good sources, was done today by me, a science academic, to prevent vandalism / non-encyclopedic edits as the BBC2 programme reaches American audiences. The edits included have this signature (Le Prof), and include the IP edits in between the Le Prof edits. Any questions or comments or issues, please reply here.

Note, there is much unsourced content remaining; all content that is sourced is followed by its citations. Please do not remove tags after phrases and sentences, because as of this date, I have determined that if a phrase or sentence is tagged, its content does not appear in the nearest or any other source appearing. Inline tags should remain until a reliable source (see WP:VERIFY) has been identified for each unsourced statement, and in each case, article content should be checked against the source, and corrected as necessary. When a fact is sourced in the main body, the inline tag in the lede (introduction) can also be removed. (Lede tags are to warn readers that summary statements bearing them are not supported by sourced statements in the main body of the article.)

Next, the title subject is indeed a Professor and department head at Exeter, though these facts remain to be sourced. (I have confirmed this, but my word does not constitute a source, any more than does that of the immediately prior IP commenter.) As it is accurate, I have left these details in for the time being, for the sake of the article's utility.

Finally, please, please, please, do not simply go to a self-published site of the Professor, and begin filling in details from it, and adding that citation to replace {{citation needed}} tags. WP:VERIFY requires independent sources. If she is indeed notable, these will exist, and must be found. Her statements about herself can appear, but only if they are consistent with published biographical information. This article is not to become an extension of the Professor's Exeter and other self-published CV material. Cheers. Le Prof Leprof 7272 (talk) 03:02, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

I'm curious. What would constitute an acceptable source for her position at the university beyond the obvious staff page there (https://humanities.exeter.ac.uk/theology/staff/), which you presumably already consulted? U Exeter decides her position, and the staff page is an official source of info about her department. What more might plausibly be required? Frphnflng (talk) 01:22, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

I think a university website counts as a reliable source for basic academic biography, unless the university is know for being unreliable in this case. If it is her employers website, it would not count as self-published. Ashmoo (talk) 18:57, 8 January 2017 (UTC)

Nature of positions and responses

This article is a bit weak. The biggest problem I see (apart from the sparsity of 3rd party sources as mentioned above) is that a lot of sources of appraisal of her work and long quotes from weak sources. For instance, there is 15 lines devoted to a minor Catholic priest's opinion and rebuttal of part of her TV show. There is also 3 paragraphs devoted to a verbal exchange she had with a bishop on a BBC chat show. I feel both are being given WP:UNDUE weight and the text should be summarised and we focus on more scholarly (or even journalistic) responses to her work. Ashmoo (talk) 15:00, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

It seems that this section is presented in order to imply her views are ill-informed or marginal. Her views on the historicity of the Bible are mainstream in modern research. as she acknowledges. This section should really contain academic reviews of her publications. Martinlc (talk) 21:32, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

Coming back two years later I see that things have improved. However, the "Scholarly positions" section still needs some work. My understanding is that her positions are almost all firmly inside the academic mainstream consensus. This should be more clearly stated. If this is not the case, the text should note it. I think her primary notability is that she is disseminating the consensus to the public, which has always held more conservative opinions. Ashmoo (talk) 11:42, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

potential additions to this section are the quotes from journal articles that are found in the "works" listing section. These should be moved into the "scholarly positions" section and worked up with some accompanying arguementation. :: Kevinalewis : ^{(Talk Page)}/_(Desk) 13:22, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

Article translated into Greek

el:Φραντζέσκα Σταυρακοπούλου. Thanks guys. ps-There is a notice that the greek article is a translation of this one. Τζερόνυμο (talk) 09:17, 22 March 2018 (UTC)