Talk:Finn the Human/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Pamzeis (talk · contribs) 06:51, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

I'm going to try to review this and not screw it up. This is my first GA review so... yeah, I'm probably going to make a lot of mistakes and please don't hesitate to point them out. Hopefully, I'll leave comments within a week. If I don't by then, ping me! Pamzeis (talk) 06:51, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

Prose and links

Lead

• the main protagonist of the — firstly, I think "main" is redundant as protagonist basically means main character. Secondly, this could potentially be omitted per WP:PROTAGONIST (a film guideline).
• American animated television series Adventure Time — a few comments here: firstly the link on "animated television series" redirects to a list of lists of animated television series and will not likely aid the reader. Secondly, linking "animated television series" may be a WP:OVERLINK as readers will likely be familiar with animation and television series. Thirdly, linking "animated television series" next to "Adventure Time" is probably WP:SEAOFBLUE.
• where he was named Pen (emphasis in original) → where he is named Pen (MOS:TENSE)
• Finn was adopted as — do these events happen before the series? If so, change was to is. If not, leave it as it is.
• infant by two sentient dogs (emphasis mine) — do you mean anthromorphic?
• human in Ooo are remarked — I believe "are" should be is.
• it is revealed that Finn is not the only human left — as someone who has never watched the series, this feels confusing to me. Firstly, with not the only human left, assumes the reader already knows that Ooo is the only world in the series (is it?) as well as suggesting humans used to live there (have they?). If the former is true, I believe in earlier in the paragraph, Ooo can be omitted. If not, I think it should be extended to "the only human left in Ooo". If the former is true I believe earlier in the paragraph, "left" should be added after "the only human".
• as his parents Martin and Minerva came from a community of survivors living on a series of islands — is this place in Ooo?
• and coming of age narrative — I believe "coming of age" should have hyphens

Creation and development

• Finn the Human is the main character of Adventure Time, and often appears alongside his best friend and adoptive brother Jake the Dog. Throughout the show, Jake acts as a more worldly, older brother type of role model. — shouldn't this be in #Appearances or #Characteristics?
• Adventure Time, and often appears — I do not think the comma is needed and also link "Adventure Time" at first mention.
• playing a Dungeons & Dragons session — what is Dungeons & Dragons? Also, you can italicise outside of links (e.g. instead of [[Dungeons & Dragons|''Dungeons & Dragons'']], put ''[[Dungeons & Dragons]]'').
• the short film [...] The short [...] The short [...] the short — a lot of "the short"s in four sentences. Try changing one or two to "it".
• Another similarity between Finn and Bueno is that both enjoy beatboxing. — I do not see any similarities brought up before this in the article.
• In the second paragraph of #Creation and design, switching between "Pen" and "Finn" feels a bit confusing. Perhaps choose just one to be more clear?
• Zack Shada was too old → Shada was too old (MOS:SURNAME)
• According to Jeremy Shada — I think it can be just Jeremy
• younger brother, "they — I believe the comma should be a colon
• two alternate, adult — I do not think the comma is needed
• as he was undergoing puberty — should puberty be linked?
• A major theme of the series is that Finn begins to see the world in more nuanced terms, rather than the naive outlook he demonstrated in earlier seasons, when many of the show's conflicts were reduced to good versus evil. — this sentence is quite long. Try splitting it.
• that this theme was part → that this theme is part
• Add a space in "storyarcs" (story arcs) and link it to story arc
• Per MOS:BQ, blockquotes should not have quotation marks.
• Instead of "[sic]", use {{sic}}
• Per MOS:CURLY, change "didn’t" to didn't.
• Adventure Time composer Tim Kiefer said that Finn's adventures were simple and meaningless in the early seasons, the show had gradually become an exploration of the classic "Hero's journey". — this sentence seems like a comma splice.

Appearances

Before I review this section, I'd like to note it seems quite long. Mind trimming it down a bit? Pamzeis (talk) 08:18, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

• I just cut it back a LOT. I was a little reluctant to remove stuff, but once I started it all seemed less necessary. BuySomeApples (talk) 19:52, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

Characteristics

• personality, boyish enthusiasm and a love — add a MOS:SERIAL comma before "and"
• and "Algebraic!" which become → and "Algebraic!" that become
• various princesses and save the world — add a MOS:SERIAL comma before "and"
• heroic code, and a thirst — I do not think the comma is needed
• small their problem." — per MOS:LQ, move the full stop outside the quotation mark
• series, but ages throughout — I do not think the comma is needed
• and was 17 by the → and is 17 by the
• long blond hair — per MOS:OVERLINK, unlink blond
• blue eyes which appear → blue eyes that appear
• of fighting, and biting — I do not think the comma is needed
• "Ocean of Fear", but overcomes — I do not think the comma is needed
• Link anthropomorphic
• the robot Neptr — should "Neptr" be capitalised as an acronym?
  • Neptr is spelled different ways in different sources (Neptr, N.E.P.T.R., NEPTR) but I'll go with NEPTR because (I think) it's the most common. BuySomeApples (talk) 19:52, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
• due to their age — should "age" be plural?
• Although Flame Princesses' fiery — are there multiple Flame Princesses? Because earlier on, the article seemed to establish there was only one
• arm, being disappointed by his father and breaking up with Flame — add a MOS:SERIAL comma before "and"
• positive, but is left — I do not think the comma is needed
• During the episode he — add a comma after "episode"
• his biological father Martin Mertens — add a comma after father (he only has one biological father, right?)
• season 6 episode 41 — "episode 41" seems quite WP:INDISCRIMINATE and will not likely aid the reader
• Founders' Island, in they hyper-protective society she helps maintain. — what does this mean?
• refuses, and convinces — I do not think the comma is needed
• has become, and reluctantly — I do not think the comma is needed
• WP:DUPLINKs of Adventure Time (season 1), Billy's Bucket List, Adventure Time (season 5), Jack the Dog, Princess Bubblegum and Adventure Time (season 6)

Reception

• associated with coming of age — I think "coming of age" needs hyphens
• remaining human - and his eventual discovery of other humans - has — per MOS:DASH, replace the hyphens with unspaced emdashes or spaced endashes
• Per WP:BQ, blockquotes should not have quotation marks
• this era’s finest → this era's finest
• sexuality, and his search — I do not think the comma is needed
• DiMaggio recalled → John DiMaggio recalled (MOS:LEADLINK and MOS:SURNAME)
• themselves to people." — per MOS:LQ, move the full stop outside the quotation mark

Verifiability and reliability

Version reviewed

• "Finn has received critical acclaim" — not mentioned in body
  • Changed this to "critical praise" to match what's in the "Reception" section. BuySomeApples (talk) 19:52, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
• "Adam Muto [...] storyboard artist for Adventure Time" — not mentioned in body
• fn 5: there is an RSN discussion which finds Looper.com unreliable. Try looking for a different source.
• fn 6: this source does not seem to support that Pen was voiced by Zack Shada
• fn 7: this source does not seem to support that Finn wears a white bear hat, nor that the hat (only his general appearance) resembles Bueno the Bear
• fn 12: this source does not seem to support that David Bradley voices elderly Finn
  • David Bradley definitely voices Finn, but I can't find any 3rd party sources that mention that (at most they include him in the cast without saying who he voices). I'm going to reluctantly remove him from the page. BuySomeApples (talk) 19:52, 17 December 2021 (UTC)
• fn 17: Forbes contributor post
• fn 6: this source does not seem to support that his random exclamations become catchphrases
• fn 3: this source does not seem to support Finn's age
• fn 70: this source seems to be a user-generated source
• fn 77: There is an RSN discussion that finds Ranker generally unreliable.
• fn 34: what makes TV Geek Army a reliable source?
• fn 67: this source does not mention "Frost & Fire"
• fn 81 & 82: what makes Overmental a reliable source?
• "According to Rich Goldstein of The Daily Beast, "Halloween nights and comic conventions of the last few years have seen an increase in the number of children (and adults) all over the U.S. who wore Finn and Jake costumes." — source?

Other

• Was there legitimately no criticism for this character? It's fine if there isn't but try searching for criticism for neutrality.
  • I tried looking for more criticism of the character in reviews but I honestly couldn't find any. I think it might be because it's an animated show originally targeted towards kids, so reviewers weren't so harsh. (Also I'm going to renominate, but I'm sorry for disappearing on this nom) BuySomeApples (talk) 19:52, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

That's what I got on first pass. Article  On hold. Ping me when these are resolved and I'll take a second look. Best of luck with this nomination! Pamzeis (talk) 02:21, 23 September 2021 (UTC)

Courtesy ping of BuySomeApples for the above comments. I'll give this nom another week unless you leave further comments. Pamzeis (talk) 06:41, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

With the nominator not responding to comments and not having edited Wikipedia since 22 September, I will reluctantly have to fail this article. No opposition to renomination once the issues above have been resolved. Pamzeis (talk) 01:10, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

@Pamzeis: it looks like a lot of your comments were already addressed by BuySomeApples before they disappeared, despite them not leaving another comment. Could you strike off what's already been addressed to your standards, and I'll take care of the rest? theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (they/them) 23:17, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi, theleekycauldron. I've struck out what I think BSA did. Please note that if you resolve these, the article will have to be renominated before it can pass as this one has already been failed. Thanks. Pamzeis (talk) 01:49, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Also, I've noticed some of my suggestions might be wrong so don't, y'know, blindly flow them. Pamzeis (talk) 01:50, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Good Article review progress box Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed