Talk:Donner Party timeline

Italics

Is there some specific reason why quoted passages are in italics? Generally quotation marks alone are used for quotations.

Sources

I'm appalled at this chronology. The author has little understanding of the Donner story and is relying on a tiny body of sources for his/her information. Ric Burns documentary is NOT an authoritative source.

What's great about Wikipedia is that editors with more knowledge of a topic can come along and improve articles, correct errors, add details, &c. Thanks for your work.

President Lethe 16:25, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

You're welcome, sort of. But what's lousy about Wikipedia is that misinformation, which may or may not get corrected, appears in an ostensibly authoritative website that ranks high in search engine hit lists. I'm tempted to delete this timeline entirely. Readers would be far better served by going elsewhere if they want detailed information about the Donner Party; there are two excellent websites with good chronologies. --DPL

I encourage continued correction of Wikipedia articles rather than their deletion. I'm glad you're making edits rather than simply deleting. Every correction increases the probability that the information gleaned most recently by a reader is correct information, whereas simple deletion of false information without corrections helps to ensure that the last information taken in was incorrect (until the reader consults another source—and, as we know, the world is full of good and poor sources, but Wikipedia is one place where groups can collaborate to change a poorer source into a better one).

President Lethe 00:22, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Luis and Salvador

I'm confused. The timeline says that they disappear into the woods on Dec 30 after Foster proposes eating them, but the death summary says that they were killed by Foster on about Jan 7. Jordan Brown (talk) 04:23, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

The snowshoers caught up with them later. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.228.152.241 (talk) 16:46, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

It is in actuality that they died from starvation after they ran off upon William Eddy telling the 2 Indians of William Foster's idea to kill them for food. So William Foster never shot them, they escaped and died later from exhaustion/starvation. At that time, their carcasses were found and eaten. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Superbustacap (talk • contribs) 05:22, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, but you don't know your sources: "[The other snowshoers] ... came upon the Indians, lying upon the ground, in a totally helpless condition. They had been without food for eight or nine days, and had been four days without fire. They could not, probably, have lived more than two or three hours; nevertheless, Eddy remonstrated against their being killed. Foster affirmed that he was compelled to do it. Eddy refused to see the deed consummated, and went on about two hundred yards, and halted. Lewis was told that he must die; and was shot through the head. Salvadore was dispatched in the same manner immediately after." -- William Eddy, per J. Quinn Thornton, Oregon and California in 1848 (1849), v. II, p. 150. Even the sympathetic C. F. McGlashan leaves no doubt that Foster killed the Indians (History of the Donner Party, p. 106) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.228.152.241 (talk) 20:05, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

When exactly did the snow start? Snow fall was fairly early, October 7 and by the end of October, snow was three feet deep at the summit, if I recall correctly. "Ordeal by Hunger" by George R. Stewart, pages 74-77. It seems crucial to an understanding of how and why they got trapped up there. StevenJTorrey (talk) 16:34, 2 February 2010 (UTC)

Overhaul

I am involved in rewriting the Donner Party article. I plan on reworking this timeline with the sources used for that article. Most of the sources used in this timeline would not be considered reliable sources for a featured list. I am also considering removing the list of the dead in favor of a separate Roster of the Donner Party members. Does anyone watching this article have any thoughts on this? --Moni3 (talk) 20:55, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

How do you think the timeline ought to be structured? I like that it is broken up into months right now - that is easier to follow than if all the events were in a single table. As you've noticed, I like tables for ease of reading, and I wonder if that would be the best approach under each month. In my ideal world, in some months the tables would have more columns, for example, so that we can track what was happening at Truckee Lake/Alder Creek separately from what the Forlorn Hope members were doing. How do you see it, Moni? As tables? As text? Karanacs (talk) 16:02, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

I tend not to think in tables. Maybe that's a cause and effect cycle because I suck at tables. I had not thought as far ahead as to how it might be structured. Maybe I was thinking I'd start putting in better cited information and it would form itself after a bit. If you have a structure you think would be a good idea, please show me. I'm interested to see it. --Moni3 (talk) 16:11, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

A rough example of what it could look like with tables is atUser:Karanacs/Donner#Timeline_mockup. This is the first time the idea has gotten out of my head - I don't know whether it works or not. Karanacs (talk) 18:15, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Seems to work for me. I think I can manage that. Btw, does Rarick have a roster? I'm working on that here and I think it's almost ready to be posted. --Moni3 (talk) 18:22, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

No, Rarick doesn't have a roster. I've included all the information that he did provide on ages in my notes. Per Kristin Johnson's blog posting about his book, he used her research for names and ages. As for the timeline mockup, I don't want to force you into something that you might not find easy to read - this is just an example and not one I'm specifically wedded to. Karanacs (talk) 18:55, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

What about coloring events on the snowshoe party? And the relief parties? --Moni3 (talk) 19:24, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

I don't mind using colors, but we need to keep Wikipedia:Accessibility#Color in mind, and not use color as the only method to differentiate. Karanacs (talk) 19:30, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

I'm working on the revamp at User:Karanacs/Donner Timeline. Karanacs (talk) 17:48, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

Deaths

Would it be helpful to add to the table of deaths the ages of those who died? On the narrative article on Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donner_Party) all the ages are written out in paragraph form and it seems pertinent to include the ages of death on this page. Mtdent23 (talk) 00:40, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Timeline Accuracy

I think there might be some sort of screw up, either here or at the "Donner Party" article, regarding the timing of Lemuel Murphy's death and the timing of the cannibalism:

December 25, 1846: ...At "Camp of Death" Patrick Dolan and young Lemuel Murphy die.

December 26, 1846: The snowshoers resort to cannibalism, "averting their faces from one another and weeping."

Versus

As the blizzard progressed, Patrick Dolan began to rant deliriously, stripped off his clothes and ran into the woods. He returned shortly afterwards and died a few hours later. Not long after, possibly because 12-year-old Lemuel Murphy was near death, some of the group began to eat flesh from Dolan's body. Lemuel's sister tried to feed some to her brother, but he died shortly afterwards.

PS: According to whom was it called the "Camp of Death"? There is not citation or reference for it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.75.38.6 (talk) 22:46, 7 June 2015 (UTC)