Talk:Culture of Ukraine

"Respect for authority", really?

Raising that kind of thing on the level of separate is quite disproportionate, and as such, certainly violates the NPOV rule. I don't see any passages about "respect for authority" in any other articles about regional cultures, although there are definitely differences in it. Furthermore, the sole purpose of that subsection is to demonstrate the reputed disrespect as a negative feature. For comparison: everybody who knows anything about Russian culture knows the famous saying of historian Nikolai Karamzin about summarizing Russia in one word: "Stealing" ("Voruyut"). There is no subsection about theft and corruption in the article Culture of Russia, despite news about it reaching international media about twice a week. Well, at least "world's highest vodka consumption" is mentioned there, although not a word about drinking being a problem in Russia. In the article Culture of the United States there is a subsection titled "Gun culture" without a word about school shooting and mass murders which in the eyes of foreigners are an outstanding feature of the U.S. culture, in heavy contrast to other developed countries. My point is not that we should insert dirt-digging subsections in the articles about different cultures, but that we don't do it as a rule, and we shouldn't do it with Ukraine, either. --Ehitaja (talk) 11:59, 31 March 2022 (UTC)

I agree. I've done a comparison of "Culture of country X" articles surrounding Ukraine, and none of them focuses on socio-economic/political problems in a society. (The templates for every article have these sections: "History People Languages Mythology and folklore Cuisine Festivals Religion Art Literature Music and performing arts Media Sport Monuments Symbols". The text of each article roughly follows this structure as well.) Not that something like corruption cannot be part of "culture" (arguably it is), but mentioning such issues in "Culture of country X" articles appears not in line with established conventions of English Wikipedia. I think we best remove this section. Cheers, Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 22:59, 23 August 2022 (UTC)

I agree in every one of the points of User:Nederlandse Leeuw. However, I still think it is appropriate to mention what I think is the point behind the previously mentioned section: i.e. that most Ukrainians traditionally not only identify with, but actively engage in antiestablishmentarianism. Something which can arguably be traced back to the Cossack rebellions, laying a red thread throughout most of Polish-Lithuanian and Imperial Russian history. (And arguably also Soviet history, though of course with a different character). —VladVP (talk) 20:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Well, I wonder whether 1. this is demonstrable with reliable sources and not just some invented tradition. After all, a great many other 'national' cultures (including the one I grew up in) claim to be rebellious, anti-authority, freedom-loving etc. and often tie that to a narrative of national history as a series of rebellions against foreign domination, usually culminating in a declaration/war of independence that is cited as 'the vindication of the freedom-loving spirit of the nation', or something along those lines. 2. Even if we were to find RS backing up such claims, I'm not sure if this is the appropriate article for it. Ukrainian nationalism seems more the place to discuss such ideas about national identity or character etc. Cheers, Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 21:09, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Discussion at Talk:Odessa § Requested move 11 July 2022

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Odessa § Requested move 11 July 2022. Rei (talk) 00:40, 12 July 2022 (UTC)