Talk:Athletics at the 2020 Summer Olympics

Numbers

Source: World Athletics "Tokyo 2020 in numbers"

3️⃣ world records (Yulimar Rojas, Karsten Warholm & Sydney McLaughlin)

1️⃣2️⃣ Olympic records

2️⃣8️⃣ area records

1️⃣5️⃣1️⃣ national records (55% set in women's events)

8️⃣2️⃣ teams reached finals (a record)

4️⃣3️⃣ teams won medals (bettered only in Sydney 2000 and Atlanta 1996)

2️⃣3️⃣ teams won gold

Burkina Faso & India became the 1️⃣0️⃣0️⃣th and 1️⃣0️⃣1️⃣st countries to win Olympic medals in athletics.

Allyson Felix won her 1️⃣0️⃣th and 1️⃣1️⃣th Olympic medals, becoming the most decorated woman in Olympic history. Only Paavo Nurmi has won more medals. No other woman in Olympic history in any sport has won more medals than Felix from five consecutive Games.

To insert in the article.--Arorae (talk) 04:01, 8 August 2021 (UTC)

Nation vs team

on 10 August 2021‎ @James Ker-Lindsay:, starting and continuating an editwar, undid twice revision 1038053873 by Arorae (commenting "pleasee provide your reason in the edit summary. The other IP user has provided his reason. Your edit clearly failed to meet the consistency set by other Olympics-related articles. Please start a discussion in the talk page if you believe that we should change "Nation" to "Team" in all Olympic medal tables". In his precedent Revert, he commented the Diff as "Unconstructive". Probably this user is the same person that the IP that moved Nation to Team but I will not ask for control or verification. I propose instead to speak about the point Nation/Team. In the Olympics, since the very first editions, all the teams competing where not (always) "Nations" or States, as the Grand-Duchy of Finland, before its indipendence in 1917, To tell the truth, citizenship was not even an issue in those first Games (as in Saint Louis 1904, where "natives" and "zulus" participated. in ghe 2020, 2 teams are clearly not Nations (EOR and ROC), and TPE or HKG are not considered as nations by PR of China. GBR represengs 4 Nations and many small islands overseas, DEN represents Faroe Islands (a different nation from Denmark). For all those reasons, "Nation" is not the good terminology to comprehend all the situations. Teams is a better denomination (as in GB team or Italy team, official denominations used by their NOCs). Here is my rationale.--Arorae (talk) 16:15, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

Comment I respect you as a long-term user, but please don't make assumptions about others and bully other users by saying that they are not experienced and they have no right to revert your edits, such as what you have told me in my talk page. I just want to point out that there are hundreds, if not thousands of Olympics-related articles in Wikipedia, and all of them use "Nation" instead of "Team" in their medal tables. Your persistency in maintaining "Team" in this article has made this article somewhat looking odd and your edit has clearly failed to meet the consistency set by other similar articles such as this one and this one.

As for your reason stated above, I don't agree with you. You seem to be confused about the difference between Nation and State/Country. The IOC uses the term Nation instead of State or Country specifically to avoid involving in some sort of political debate about whether a political entity is a country or not (i.e. host nation instead of host country). The term Nation means people and/or the area these people represent. In the 2020 (2021) edition, EOR represents all international refugees (people) from around the world, ROC represents the people from the Russian Federation. From China's perspective, Taiwan and Hong Kong are not countries, but no one can deny the fact that both areas are nations and TPE and HKG are representing the people from these areas. In fact, even Tibet is a nation, the difference between Tibet and Taiwan or Hong Kong is that they don't have IOC membership, that's why they cannot compete in the Olympics independently. For GBR, it is a nation representing four non-sovereign countries (constituent countries). For DEN, it is a similar story.

Unless you could provide very solid statements to convince everyone in the community that the term Nation is not appropriate for Olympics-related articles, we will not change hundreds and thousands of articles just because you don't agree with this usage. James Ker-Lindsay (talk) 04:45, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

I am not "confused" at all, show some respect (with a PhD in Political science): "we" ? You seems the only one here that doesn't understand that Nation is inappropriate term here. and your rationale is completely false, especially for HKG.--Arorae (talk) 08:48, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

There is nothing to brag about your PhD in political science, man. Just google his name, he could be one of the professors who examined your PhD thesis lol. 144.130.162.86 (talk) 08:26, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

"Nation" is the accepted term here. We could spell out National Olympic Committee each time, but that would be silly. Abbreviating it as NOC would be user-unfriendly. Nation is an appropriate shorthand. -- Jonel (Speak to me) 09:07, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

@Jonel:: accepted by who ? you are the ruler of this discussion? Wikipedia is a place of discussion and improvement.--Arorae (talk) 11:09, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

Accepted by the community, in particular the Olympics WikiProject which has long used the term. Yes, Wikipedia is a place of discussion and improvement--but it's a place where you ought to be civil, and one where if you want to discuss a major change such as this that affects thousands of articles, the best place is at the WikiProject talk page (as DeFacto has initiated) rather than sniping at IPs in edit summaries and on the talk page of a single affected article. -- Jonel (Speak to me) 12:27, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

Just show me the place where the Community (notably of Olympics WikiProject) has recommanded that Nation should be used instead of team, delegation or mission? I am sure that no consensus has never be discussed on this topic. There is no rule or definitive prescription on that issue.--Arorae (talk) 15:58, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

We literally have a manual of style page for "nations" at Wikipedia:OLYMOSNAT. I'm not interested in dredging 19 years of WikiProject history to look for discussions; the pervasive, long-standing, fairly consistent use of the term throughout—again—literally thousands of pages is a pretty solid indicator of consensus. That said, everything is always up for discussion and if you can show a consensus to change it, so be it. -- Jonel (Speak to me) 16:27, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

• Note - I have started a general discussion about this very subject at WT:OLYMPICS#NOC/nation/team terminology as it is cropping up at various Olympics-related articles. Please come along and contribute there. -- DeFacto (talk). 10:54, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

Why take away facts? (from Rankings, Records figure section)

@DeFacto: (who doesn't like to discuss this on his own page and Reverted it twice): I would like initially to thank you... but now, you have taken off the competition rankings that I had inserted in Athletics at 2020 Summer Olympics' section. I do not understand why you did. They are sourced by a Press release from WA, and they give important info about the rankings of last major championships in the last years (those rankings exist since 2000 — not before that) and they give a good info about the quality of each championships. --Arorae (talk) 10:38, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

Arorae, as I wrote in my edit summary: "per WP:UNDUE no need for this detail from this one survey". As this is just one survey and from just one of the bodies representing just one of the sporting disciplines represented at the Olympics, I think just the summary of its results are fine, but the list of detailed scores is unnecessary and inclusion gives it undue weight in the article per WP:UNDUE. -- DeFacto (talk). 11:31, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

UNDUE? who decided that this detail is unnecessary? We are in Athletics article and WA was the organizer and governing body. WA flag was in the Olympic Stadium and WA officials control the event. We are not in the "just one" that you have said (3 times). our opinion is opposite, sorry.--Arorae (talk) 15:54, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

Does anyone outside of WA pay any attention to that ranking system? Any secondary sources report on it? What's the significance of the numbers themselves, rather than the description given? I tend to agree DeFacto on this--the summary is enough. -- Jonel (Speak to me) 16:34, 11 August 2021 (UTC)