Talk:Angela Smith (South Yorkshire politician)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians, I have just modified one external link on Angela C. Smith. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090619180600/http://www.angelasmith-mp.org.uk/about_angela_smith_mp.htm to http://www.angelasmith-mp.org.uk/about_angela_smith_mp.htm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}). This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 22:51, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

APPG on water section

This section is a very negatively worded section and reads like pro-nationalisation and anti-water industry propaganda. It will be contended that the whole point of the group is to be pro water industry but Wikipedia cannot take a POV on either side. The while section needs re-writing or scrapping as it potentially falls fous of the rules regarding POV where selectivity of inclusion is being undertaken. Why are not all her APPGs listed here and why only this instance. Sparkle1 (talk) 08:58, 10 September 2019 (UTC)

Agree. Scrap section, which is not about her, and put her views on water industry in Parliamentatry career section. Jontel (talk) 09:52, 10 September 2019 (UTC)

Requested move 18 November 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: No consensus. While a no consensus determination does imply that a speedy renomination to gain consensus is acceptable, I would highly advise holding off for two days. The result of the election will be a useful factor in considering a move. (closed by non-admin page mover) SITH (talk) 12:53, 11 December 2019 (UTC)

---

Angela Smith (South Yorkshire politician) → Angela Smith (Liberal Democrat politician) – Time to move this - again! She's now standing in Manchester instead of Yorkshire. Unreal7 (talk) 12:55, 18 November 2019 (UTC) —Relisting. Steel1943 (talk) 18:46, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

• Move to Angela Smith (politician). There's already a hatnote pointing to the baroness and there's no other politician. (Alternatively, back to Angela C. Smith per WP:NATURAL, [1] although that doesn't seem very common.) She's only very recently a Liberal Democrat. Station1 (talk) 22:24, 18 November 2019 (UTC)
  • Angela Smith, Baroness Smith of Basildon is quite clearly also a politician and there is no primary topic. -- Necrothesp (talk) 16:45, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
    • Certainly, but as I wrote, there's already a hatnote pointing to the baroness. Under the circumstances, there's no special benefit to using the longer qualifier, especially if it's no longer accurate. Station1 (talk) 22:09, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
      • That's not how we disambiguate though. Two people of the same names who are both politicians and neither is primary. A hatnote is not the way to do it. Of course it's relevant, unless and until she's elected for the Manchester seat. If she isn't then she was only ever notable as a South Yorkshire politician. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:27, 21 November 2019 (UTC)
        • Anyone searching for or linking to Angela Smith properly gets to the dab page where both are listed. The redirect Angela Smith (politician) averages zero hits per day, so is virtually unused. Since the baroness is naturally disambiguated, and is linked from the hatnote, the extremely rare person looking for the baroness at Angela Smith (politician) would be no worse off. The benefit is that the politician now running in a new party and location would have a more neutral title. Station1 (talk) 06:13, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
          • As I said, simply not how we do disambiguation. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:52, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
• Support per nomination. Although Angela Smith only joined Liberal Democrats two months ago, she immediately received the post of Liberal Democrat Spokesperson for International Development and her election website is filled with promotion for Liberal Democrats, thus indicating that the party represents her most actively recognisable current identification. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 10:17, 19 November 2019 (UTC)
• Oppose I don't think it's appropriate to disambiguate a politician who has been notable in several political parties by her current political party. Ralbegen (talk) 11:49, 19 November 2019 (UTC)
• Oppose. Fine as it is unless she gets elected. -- Necrothesp (talk) 16:45, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
• Support per nomination. - she is known more than for just South Yorkshire JLo-Watson (talk) 21:24, 21 November 2019 (UTC)
  • However, she's not know at all as a Liberal Democrat politician! She's been an MP for 14 years, all but nine months of that time as Labour (and only two months as Lib Dem). So how on earth is the proposed disambiguator accurate or helpful? This is pure WP:RECENTISM. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:56, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
• Postpone the discussion until after the election. If she is not returned for Altrincham then she will be primarily notable as a former Labour MP for constituencies in South Yorkshire, and the article should stay where it is. If she is elected for Altrincham then she will be primarily notable as the sitting Liberal Democrat MP for a Manchester constituency, and the article should be moved to the proposed title. She probably won’t be elected. Opera hat (talk) 15:40, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
• Oppose proposed move per Necrothesp. I suggest we instead go with Angela Smith (politician, born 1961) (especially if she is successful in the upcoming election). The natural option doesn't work as sources don't use her middle name, and we have to distinguish from Angela Smith, Baroness Smith of Basildon (who was also a politician). Iffy★Chat -- 11:32, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
  • I'd be happy with that too. Unfortunately, many editors don't like disambiguation by year of birth. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:10, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
    • The baroness was born in 1959, so birth year is unlikely to help many people tell them apart. Station1 (talk) 08:47, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
      • Not relevant to disambiguation. As long as they are told apart a different year of birth is fine. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:10, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
• Comment This is a difficult one and I think good points have been raised on all sides. At the moment Angela Smith has never been elected as a Liberal Democrat and most of political career saw her serve in the Labour Party. Thus I am not sure the rename reflects the article or the subject's career fairly. If she were to be re-elected or went to the House of Lords then a case could be made for including the Liberal Democrat in the article name, but in the latter case a peerage title might be the obvious way to go to distinguish her from he namesake. I think the year of birth suggestion might be a better way of doing things, but alternately waiting until after the election might be the best option. Dunarc (talk) 16:18, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
• Oppose, not defined as a Liberal Democrat, that is recentism. Support Angela Smith (politician, born 1961). —SmokeyJoe (talk) 21:51, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

---

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.