Talk:Alex Ríos/Archive 1

2007 Season

Re: July 11 edit. It is not a fact to say that salary arbitration is "particularly arduous." It is redundant to say that he was "subsequently" named to the All-Star game. Why do we have to say that he "ultimately" finished second? It's redundant. He finished 2nd. Plain and simple..short and sweet. It is unnecessary to detail how many HR's Rios hit in the individual rounds. It doesn't add any value to the Alex Rios page. What set him apart from the others was the total. The same information is on the competition page and will be linked as a compromise. The problem with wikipedia is that it tends to not read like an encyclopedia. Please register an account to discuss your reasons for making edits. Coolbrook76 14:00, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Puerto Rican and/or American or what?

I was engaged in a similar discussion over Ray Barretto a few months ago, and I was corrected from saying Ray (who was born in New York City) was American to Puerto Rican-American. So I thought that was the acceptable compromise.

I don't agree that the long formulation is nonsense. When you are born in Alabama, you are American by definition. You can choose to have your favorite hyphen added, such as Italian-American or Laotian-American, or you can drop the ancestry bit. You cannot drop the "American". For legal purposes, Alex is American. For most fans, Alex is American.

I have noted that some people here in Wikipedia engage in Puerto Rican activism (for example, I had to correct some exaggerated coverage of Puerto Rico-related stuff in the Ernesto Sabato entry). Now, anybody is entitled to an opinion, but let me posit that not writing that Alex is American is factually incorrect, and reeks of POV.

Regardless: Go Jays! elpincha 03:19, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Again, Puerto Ricans are American, the reason I am aganist him being labeled as Puerto Rican-American is because its basically the same as labeling someone as American-American, now considering the fact that his lineage is completely Puerto Rican, that he has lived and developed his baseball skills there and that he has always identified himself as Puerto Rican those reasons are strong to keep it as it is, after all its not like we are trying to hide he was born in Alabama. -凶 03:39, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Now, cases about if somebody if Puerto Rican are really complex and you are bound to see them in Wikipedia often, for example everybody born in the island is instantly Puerto Rican as a result of a hundred year old legal loophole, regardless of the origin of their parents of if he/she was born there during a pleasure vacation (I will explain this latter as it is a little confusing). Now Alexis being born in the US is free of this but he choose to indentify himself as Puerto Rican, and when given the chance of choosing to who his "sports nacionality" would belong he immediatly accepted Puerto Rico even when other player who were born in the island gave excuses. The Olympic commitee only allows the player to represent one team in their entire life and he decided to go with his lineage even if he knew that he could wait to make an impact in MLB and attemp to play for the US in the next WBC. Now to explain the loophole I mentioned above, following the events where Spain surendered Puerto Rico to the United States in the Spanish-American war (1898) the Puerto Rican nationality was recognized, in 1917 the United States granted the citizens there the American citizenship without the requirement that they renounce the Puerto Rican citizenship. Since then no legal action has been taken to make the Puerto Rican citizens renounce the PR citizenship, so basically everybody born in the island since 1917 has dual-citizenship. I know that last part had nothing to do with Alex, the Jays or Baseball for that matter but I hope it helps you consider all angles before saying there is Puerto Rican activism in Wikipedia, cheers. -凶 03:58, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

That was quick. Thanks. Even though all the above points are correct, the statement "Alex Rios is American" remains factually true. Because of that, the current resolution, while maybe better than whatever stuff I may come up with, is still not entirely satisfying (to me at least). The points discussed may be too subtle to a casual reader.

BTW, as an analogous example, see how the nationalities David Trezeguet and Mauro Camoranesi are described on their articles (and there is Argentine activism on the English Wikipedia ;) elpincha 04:35, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

I see your point, while I will always defend my point about Puerto Rican-American being nonsense, I think we must reach a mid-point here, If he was born in New York we could use the term Nuyorican but there is no term for Puerto Ricans born in Alabama, perhaps saying is a Puerto Rican MLB player born in the United States can do it, what do you think? -凶 04:59, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Pittsburgh project?

Alex "attended" the All-Star game in Pittsburgh (he didn't play since he was sick). So, is he relevant to the "Pittsburgh project"? Or is there another connection? I mean, we in Toronto do not want to share Alex with noooobody—we can give a free pass to Alabama and to Puerto Rico, but Pittsburgh?--—Preceding unsigned comment added by Elpincha (talk • contribs) 05:02, 16 July 2007