Talk:2007 Pacific hurricane season/Archive 1

Disambig

There was a Tropical Cyclone Bertie-Alvin in the 2005-06 Southern Hemisphere tropical cyclone season. Thus, when Alvin forms (Its the first name on the list... even a slow year will easily reach it) make sure that Tropical Storm Alvin is a disambiguation page. I recommend that Hurricane Alvin and Tropical Cyclone Alvin redirect to that disambiguation page so future users know about it... unless of course this year's Alvin is really evil. Miss Madeline | Talk to Madeline 18:26, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

I'll take care of it once Alvin forms. --Coredesat 00:58, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Dab created. --Coredesat 03:19, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

MfD on discussion archives

Hi, just drawing attention to Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Tropical cyclone discussion archives. Up for deletion are all the archives of discussion about tropical cyclones on the seasonal pages, as opposed to the archives of Wikipedia-related discussion. See the nomination for the rationale for deletion. The thoughts of contributors here be appreciated on the discussion.--Nilfanion (talk) 21:21, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

What this article needs

This article desperately needs information about pre-season forecasts. Anyone? – Chacor 01:55, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, but I don't think they have come out yet. Anyone know when the NOAA forecasts are going to be released? Looks like they'll come out on May 22.[1] (In the past few years, the forecasts for three basins have been released on the same day.) --Ajm⁸¹ 11:30, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Timeline

Why is the timeline being kept in the article when there is a separate list/article for it?---CWY2190^TC 03:42, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

The timeline in the main article is for recent events (it should say "Timeline of recent events", but it doesn't; I'll fix that). Since all of the events are recent, all that info is there. -- RattleMan 04:11, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

At the beginning of each month, if there are no active cyclones, the previous month is removed. May is on there right now because Barbara is still active. —Cuiviénen 21:03, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Barbara Article

Why does Tropical Storm Barbara need an article? Reub2000 02:22, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

It doesn't need one. I started one after I thought it would do much more, and published it after it did what it did. Hurricanehink (talk) 02:27, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

In general, all land-impacting Pacific hurricanes will ultimately get articles, but most that stay out to sea will not. CrazyC83 23:03, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

Alvin TCR

Its up [2]Jason Rees 19:28, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

TD3E TCR

Its up - [3] Jason Rees 17:58, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

ACE table order

Is there any reason that the ACE table isn't alphabetical/chronological? I'll rearrange it in a couple days if no one objects. 199.172.246.196 15:03, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

I object. Yes, there's a reason the ACE table isn't alphabetical or chronological - the table is about ACE, so it only makes sense to list the storms in terms of their ACE value. Therefore, I object, it should stay the way as is, sorted by ACE value. It would make no sense to have a list of ACE not sorted by the value it's being listed for. – Chacor 15:19, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

It definitely makes more sense to arrange by ACE rather than chronologically. As Chacor said, the subject of the table is ACE. This ranks cyclones by their energy output, rather than by formation date. The individual storm blurbs already serve the latter purpose. - SpLoT // 15:45, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

I object as well. While I do see the sense in listing it alphabetically, I prefer it to be from greatest to least, as any superlative table would be. If one wished to do so, there could be a season impact table at the bottom of the article, as done in a few other articles. This is what it would look like.

{{TC stats table start|year=2007|basin=Pacific hurricane}}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=storm|name=Alvin|dates=26 - 31 May|
max-winds=40 |min-press=1003|ace= 0.61}}
{{TC stats no landfall}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=0 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=storm|name=[[Tropical Storm Barbara (2007)|Barbara]]|dates=29 May - 2 June|
max-winds=50|min-press=1000|ace= 1.98}}
{{TC stats first landfall|where=just NW [[Mexico]]/[[Guatemala]] border|date=[[June 2]]|winds=50|cat=storm}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=55 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=depression|name=Three-E|dates=11 - 13 June|
max-winds=30|min-press=1004|ace= 0}}
{{TC stats no landfall}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=0 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=depression|name=Four-E|dates=9 - 11 July|
max-winds=35|min-press=1006|ace= 0}}
{{TC stats no landfall}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=0 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=depression|name=Five-E|dates=14 - 15 July|
max-winds=35|min-press=1006|ace= 0}}
{{TC stats no landfall}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=0 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=cat1|name=Cosme|
dates=14 - 23 July|max-winds=75|min-press=987|ace= 2.73}}
{{TC stats no landfall}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=0 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=storm|name=Dalila|dates=21 - 27 July|
max-winds=60|min-press=997|ace= 2.73}}
{{TC stats no landfall}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=0 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats cyclone|cat=storm|name=Erick|dates=31 July - 2 August|
max-winds=40|min-press=1004|ace= 0.49}}
{{TC stats no landfall}}
{{TC stats impact|damage=0 |deaths=0 }}
{{TC stats table end|num-cyclones-text='''8 cyclones<b>|dates=[[May 27]] |max-winds=75|min-press=<b>987'''|tot-ace='''8.62'''|num-landfalls=1|tot-damage='''55'''
|tot-deaths=0}}

However, it would be an annoyance to keep updating it with every storm, so I would advise not adding a season summary table, either, until all of the tropical cyclone reports are out. Hurricanehink (talk) 21:26, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Ah, I didn't notice that they were listed by ACE rank. I don't know how I missed that. You are all absolutely right, it makes more sense as it is. 199.172.246.196 12:14, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

TD5E TCR

Its up [4] Jason Rees 19:24, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Flossie article

THE CURRENT TRACK AND INTENSITY FORECAST MAY REQUIRE WATCHES FOR PORTIONS OF THE HAWAIIAN ISLANDS ON MONDAY.

Based on this, when - and only IF - watches get issued, should an article be created, much like the Atlantic status quo. – Chacor 15:40, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Why wait until watches/warnings are issued? Just wait until the storm is over? ---CWY2190^TC 17:23, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

I say that a sandbox should begin, and should watches or warnings get issued, it should be created at Hurricane Flossie (2007). CrazyC83 18:43, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

I'll start working on one tonight. Hurricanehink (talk) 18:46, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Eh, scratch that (something came up). If someone else wants to make a sandbox, they can, but if no one wants to, I'll do it tomorrow. Hurricanehink (talk) 02:51, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Watches out.[5] Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 19:38, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Barbara and Erick TCRs

• Barbara - not much of change.
• Erick - pressure down to 1004. Mitch^contribs 17:46, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Wow i wasnt expecting these for a while yet since they have only just gotten rid off Dean so we are now waiting for 4E and dalia since we wont get Cosme and Flossie for a while since they were cpac storms Jason Rees 18:00, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

TD 4-E TCR

[6] --Ajm⁸¹ 22:41, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Dalila TCR

[7] --Ajm⁸¹ 22:53, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Dean-Gil?

Hi. It appears tropical storm Gil formed partially from the remnants of Dean. When the remnants of Dean made it into the Pacific as 93.E invest, the main convection moved overland into Arizona et al, but a large part of the storm continued travelling west into the Pacific. Is it possible that, as the convection in 93.E invest continued to dissapate, it refired nearby and became 94.E invest then Gil? Could someone check the satellite loops to see if this is possible? In the currently-unlikely event that this is confirmed, what will the article be like? Hurricane Dean-Gil? What does such an article usually look like? Also, even though Dean dissapated beyond recognision as a tropical depression, were this to be confirmed, would the articles stay separate, like TD 10 and Katrina, or merged into one article, like Fifi-Orleane? Thanks. ~AH1^(TCU) 15:40, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

It is not the case. The last Pacific TWO that mentioned the remnants of Dean indicated it was near Baja California. Two days later, the system that became Gil was first mentioned several hundred miles southwest of Acapulco. Unless the trade winds magically blew the remnants of Dean southeastward and the NHC did not want to mention that the remnants of Dean had redeveloped, then I am quite sure that Dean had no connection to Gil. Hurricanehink (talk) 15:45, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

WP:NOR, AH1. Please stop coming up with crazy fantasies. What you suggested did not happen. – Chacor 17:00, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Henriette sandbox article

Due to the six deaths caused by Tropical Storm Henriette, I have created a sandbox article for us to add info to in the future should it became appropriate to create an article for Henriette.

Part of my justification for creating a sandbox article now is the fact that Henriette's six deaths thus far equal its total to that of last year's Hurricane John, which has an article, and exceed that of last year's Hurricane Lane, which also has an article.

I may not be able to edit again until later this week, and Henriette will probably be long dissipated by then, so you may add info to my sandbox and publish it when it becomes appropriate. Of course, if for whatever reason we decided not to create an article on this system, you may freely have my sandbox emptied. Miss Madeline | Talk to Madeline 23:34, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Awesome, sounds like a good idea. It will probably need one prior to its next landfall. Hurricanehink (talk) 23:45, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

It appears that Mitchazenia also has one; see User:Mitchazenia/EP11E. Had I known that one existed I wouldn't have created mine. I guess we can always have some admin merge them, although my sandbox article is more complete. Miss Madeline | Talk to Madeline 23:52, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Yea, go with yours. Hurricanehink (talk) 00:09, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

I jus wanted to check the protocol before i go ahead and change things cos im still learning the ropes here. On the 2007 pacific hurricane page it says that there have been 7 named storms when in fact henriette is the eighth. Do you only change that after the system has disspated. Some people may find this confusing. any answers for this? (Seddon69 11:36, 3 September 2007 (UTC))

Nice catch. Yeah, there have been 8 storms. You can go ahead and change it. -- RattleMan 11:52, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

I added a track at Image:Henriette_2007_track.png to the Commons. Q ^{T C} 08:17, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

• Can someone move the sandbox to mainspace? There already are confirmed fatalities due to the second landfall, and adding that info there would make the current section overwhelm the rest of the season. Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 05:49, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

The move has been made, although some work definitely needs to still be done to the article. CrazyC83 00:40, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Landfall times obviously wrong

The article states "1:30 p.m. PDT (2030 UTC) - Hurricane Henriette makes landfall" However is is currently 1955 UTC. I'm not sure if the editor used the wrong timezone and/or the wrong time. But as it stands it's predicting the future. Jon 20:03, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

the NHC advisory for Henriette's Baja landfall was released at 2:00pm PDT (2100z) It looks like a rough estimate time to me. - グリフオーザー 03:29, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Here's the link, which confirms it was at 0015 UTC on September 6. Hurricanehink (talk) 03:33, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

he is talking about the first landfall, I believe - グリフオーザー 03:39, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Looks correct to me, see sources for first and second. --Ajm⁸¹ 05:35, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Coverage question

Why this gets less coverage than the atlantic? I'm not an expert so I'm asking --TheFEARgod (Ч) 13:11, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Since Atlantic storms affect the United States (and not so many Pacific storms do so), where a large number of users are from, people (myself included) put more interest into the Atlantic storms. Hurricanehink (talk) 14:45, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Also, Pacific hurricanes are, on the whole, far less of a threat than Atlantic ones. The worst Pacific storm, in dollar figures, was Pauline, which did around $9b in 2007 dollars to Mexico; the worst Atlantic storm did around 10x that much. The deadliest Pacific storm, the 1959 Mexico hurricane, killed over 1800 people; there are at least 10 storms in the Atlantic that have killed more than 3000 each, and four are estimated to have killed up to 10,000 people. So while it's a notable basin, it's clear why it doesn't get quite the coverage or attention as the Atlantic.

It also comes down to the fact that, apart from Honolulu and Acapulco and Culiacán (my lack of knowledge of Mexico may be leading me to forget others), there's no major cities in the path of Pacific hurricanes, whereas the Atlantic gives us, just the short list, working south: Halifax, New York, Virginia Beach, Jacksonville, Miami, Tampa, New Orleans, Houston, Veracruz, Cancún, Havana, San Juan, Port-au-Prince, Kingston, and Santo Domingo, as well as the many tiny Caribbean islands that the eastern Pacific basin lacks. (I'm sharing Central America between both basins so no need to duplicate names) --Golbez 15:11, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

That is correct. 80-90% of the time, Pacific hurricanes are fish-spinners that form in the same general area and basically take the same path. Only about 20-25% of Atlantic hurricanes (and none in 2006 or 2007 so far) do not impact land at one point or another. CrazyC83 00:26, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

On page warning

I'm removing the "Seek info from local authorities" box. The HPC just issued it's first and last advisory on the storm. This means that official sources no longer deem it a flooding threat, or a threat of any kind. Therefore I'm removing it. -- §HurricaneERICarchive 00:27, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

• You've stated a false premise, though. While it's not as important with Pacific cyclones as it is with Atlantic ones, on more than one occasion the NHC simply "cuts its losses" and hands it off to the HPC while the storm is starting a transition (and in at least one recent case, even without such a transition). If the NHC does indeed wait until there's no flooding threat before issuing its last advisory, there would be no HPC advisories afterwards. It would be more prudent to wait until the HPC states in an advisory that the storm has lost all tropical characteristics - or stops issuing advisories on it - before removing it from the active list here on Wikipedia. B.Wind 22:55, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Cosme TCR

[8] --Ajm⁸¹ 22:35, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

CPHC version is now available here. --Ajm⁸¹ 03:10, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Gil TCR

[9] --Ajm⁸¹ 03:34, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

TD 13E TCR

[10] Good kitty 00:54, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Juliette TCR

[11] Good kitty (talk) 18:58, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Kiko TCR

[12] Jason Rees (talk) 22:33, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Henriette TCR

[13] --Ajm⁸¹ 22:11, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Flossie TCR'S

CPHC Jason Rees (talk) 02:56, 29 November 2007 (UTC)