Help talk:Table/Archive 2

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Compact rows with pipe syntax?

Hi. I would like to have one row/line using the pipe syntax. Is this possible? For instance, I would like something such as:

{|
|- || row1 col1 || col2 || col3
|- || row2 col1 || col2 || col3
|}

But this doesn't seem to work, and looking at the source (Parser.php), it doesn't look like it is going to. I'm puzzled why there isn't such a syntax, because it seems like it is important for dense tables where you'd like to be able to see to edit them. One solution that works is:

{|
|-
| row1 col1 || col2 || col3<tr>
| row2 col1 || col2 || col3
|}

But I don't really feel comfortable having every line end in a <tr>. Is it reasonable? Against the "rules"? Thanks. jhawkinson (talk) 00:49, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

---

Separate each row with a |- like this:

{|
|-
| row1 col1 || col2 || col3
|-
| row2 col1 || col2 || col3
|}

This is because you might actually want a line break in the cell text. The |- actually renders as an HTML <tr>, but you should keep the markup clean so other editors can figure out what you are doing. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 01:05, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

I understand I can do it with |- on a line by itself. That is what I am trying to avoid! When there is a lot of data, blowing two lines for each row instead of one makes a big difference in readibility. jhawkinson (talk) 01:22, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Table format problem

Hi! I would need some help in European Patent Convention. The second table, titled "States with an extension agreement with the European Patent Office, with respective date of entry into force" has wider rows than the two others, but the format information is the same... How could I fix that? Thanks for any hint! --Edcolins (talk) 21:15, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

I removed the explicit heights from the table headers. Is that what you had in mind? —EncMstr 21:32, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

If you mean taller rows, then someone just fixed it. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 21:34, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I meant taller. Thanks a lot for your help! That's just great now. --Edcolins (talk) 00:16, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

no longer working?

On the help page, in the section Help:Tables#Decimal_point_alignment, the markup given using the 50% width to align 4.321, 43.21, etc. (the second example) no longer appears aligned in that section. Do those 4321's appear aligned at the decimal point in anyone else's browser, or has this solution been deprecated? -- Thisis0 (talk) 05:09, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

I wondered about that the first time I saw this. The way it is done, there is an optical illusion that the decimal column is slanted. This example would have been better with the same number of decimals:

432 .21

43 .21

4 .21

--— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 12:28, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

No, there's no case at all of optical illusion. What you've done above is rather humorous, because with no special formatting, the decimals would have lined up just fine; using the same number of decimals right-justified will always keep the decimals aligned. However, with your "50%" formatting, you've actually forced the decimal points to not be aligned. Look closely. Better yet, drag your browser to a screen edge and see for yourself how you've just made decimals vertically askew that would normally line up just fine. <ahem> So anyway... the goal is a solution to line up the decimals with different amounts of numbers after the decimal. The first solution works, but the second obviously no longer does. At least in my browser. Anyone else? -- Thisis0 (talk) 00:53, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

The second example does not work for me. If however replacing % with px

432 .1

43 .21

4 .321

it works! But I dont know if this is the optimal way to fix it. Najro (talk) 18:45, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

It does work, and fits the style, and also follows the text which says to "specify" the column width. So I changed it as Najro suggested. I thought it was straightforward enough, and pointed to this talk header in my sig. Any reason for me not to have changed it? -:-  AlpinWolf   -:- 04:34, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Displaying code section - what's the point?

What's the point of the "Displaying the table code which generates a table" section? It doesn't seem to have anything to do with tables. Apart from the rather dubious suggestion of replacing pipe characters with their HTML entity quivalents, this section could equally apply to displaying *any* wikitext. It really should go in another page somewhere, shouldn't it? Stevage 00:13, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

I hadn't noticed it before. It does some to be of little worth, except for those who have to display wikitable code. And that answer can be found by looking at the source of the page.... —EncMstr 00:51, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

• That displaying-code section was still there (after a year), so I am moving that section into a separate help-file named "Help:Display markup examples". -Wikid77 (talk) 17:48, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Hideable tables?

Is it possible to have a table's content be hide able, in the same way that {{hidden}} or {{Navbox}} works? Or is it possible to put a table into the hidden template? I've been unable to figure out how to do this so far. Any ideas? Drewcifer (talk) 19:22, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

How about {{Navbox with columns}}? --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 01:03, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

That's definately closer to what I was thinking, but unfortunately it makes everything smaller and doesn't allow for some of the more complex table tricks like rowspan, colspan, align, etc. Drewcifer (talk) 14:27, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

These table classes might help:

• collapsible
• collapsed
• autocollapse

I have not worked with these, but they are used in the navbox core template: {{Navbox/core}}. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 17:48, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

That worked great! Thanks. For anyone interested, there's more instruction here: Help:Collapsing. Drewcifer (talk) 21:33, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

List of classes

Speaking of the above (collapsible table classes), shouldn't we have a list of all the different classes and what they do? You'd think the "Classes" section would do that, but it doesn't really. For instance, I still have no idea what the difference is between "wikitable" and "prettytable". Drewcifer (talk) 22:41, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

See #Table parameters above. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 23:16, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Ah, I see. But why isn't that on the actual help page? Also, some explanations of each would be nice, no? Drewcifer (talk) 00:10, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

We could start a section on classes and tag it with expand. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 13:51, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Sound list

I'm having difficulty with a sortable list. Can someone help? wikipedia:sound/list has a very wide column on the left, titled "File Name (click to download)." First of all, I tried to make this column narrower by specifying its width, but it didn't work. Can someone else please try to make this huge column narrower? Also, is there a way to select only material in that column to copy and paste? When I try to copy that column to paste, I end up having to copy the entire table. Furthermore, is there a quick and easy way to move the column titled "composer" over to the left-hand-side of the table? The list has hundreds of rows, and I don't want to have to edit the code for each row individually. Thanks in advance for any help.Ferrylodge (talk) 20:37, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

I've used several fairly large hammers on it, and can't get it to budge. I'll work on it some more in a few hours. —EncMstr 22:16, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, that would be great. Much appreciated....Ferrylodge (talk) 22:18, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

I've got the columns narrowed now. The key was to replace underscores with spaces in the URLs listed in the left-most column.

But that still leaves the other questions. Is there a way to select only material in the left column to copy and paste? When I try to copy that column to paste, I end up having to copy the entire table. Furthermore, is there a quick and easy way to move the column titled "composer" over to the left-hand-side of the table? The list has hundreds of rows, and I don't want to have to edit the code for each row individually. Thanks.Ferrylodge (talk) 23:19, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

Yes indeed: Hold down Ctrl while selecting the column you want. At least it works in Mozilla, SeaMonkey, and FireFox. As for changing the column order, several ideas come to mind. You want me to change it? —EncMstr 23:42, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

That's great. I added an explanation at the top of the table about how to select a column. I went to a computer that uses Firefox, and it worked fine (though it did not work on my primary computer which only has Internet Explorer). Unfortunately, when I switched to the compuyer that uses Firefox, it looks like the left-most column is very wide again. Grr. Anyway, regarding how to move the composer column over to the far left, please do that if you can, and please also let me know if there's a simple way for me to do that myself in the future. Thanks.Ferrylodge (talk) 00:03, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Colors

I have created a table using background colors. When I print it out, the colors don't get printed. I have used both "style" and "bground" commands for the colors. Medicjm (talk) 12:01, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

This is a browser issue. In FireFox, you would set File > Page Setup > Print Background. There is a similar setting for IE and other browsers. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 12:03, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Bad link in section: External links

The (more information) link is bad. The first link on the line, gives the correct www - it is http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benutzer:Duesentrieb/csv2wp_%28en%29 Power.corrupts (talk) 09:56, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

2-column gallery for wide images

Hello all. Any suggestions as to how create a table that looks like the standard <gallery></gallery> format, but with two wide images (or even one wide image) instead of four standard ones. Any help would be appreciated. Cheers - Gobeirne (talk) 22:07, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, here's one quick and dirty way to approximate it. First is a standard gallery for comparison:

• 
  Pied Cormorant
• 
  Surrealistically beautiful
• 
  Spider & fly
• 
  Inquisitive bird

Then a table arranged as 2x2 using gallery style with thumbnails twice as wide as the gallery makes them.

Pied Cormorant	Surrealistically beautiful
Spider & fly	Inquisitive bird

Further refinement would be to override the thumbnail image style—if desired—to remove their borders, maybe even the little expand icon. Is this good enough? —EncMstr 19:30, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Or are you looking for something more like this? --jjron (talk) 11:56, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

• Sample gallery
• 
  Pied Cormorant
• 
  Surrealistically beautiful

• Both those options are fantastic :) Thanks! - Gobeirne (talk) 19:05, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

suppress horizontal border?

Can somebody help me write a table with two columns and four rows, such that between the first and second row and also between 3rd and 4th there is no horizontal border line? I can't figure it out. Thanks, Jakob.scholbach (talk) 20:34, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Do you mean like this?:

col 1	col 2
row 1 col 1 row 2 col 1	row 1 col 2 row 2 col 2
row 3 col 1 row 4 col 1	row 3 col 2 row 4 col 2

—EncMstr 21:28, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, very good. Thanks again Jakob.scholbach (talk) 22:55, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Propose delete Wikitable spacing overlap problems subsection

I've posted a proposed change at Template talk:Ph:Table which is the place from which the "Wikipedia-specific help" content on this page comes, but since I suspect few people look at that discussion page, I thought I'd post a note here requesting input. Please read the proposal at Template talk:Ph:Table and post any support, opposition, or comments there. Thanks. --Bryan H Bell (talk) 03:54, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Vandalized

This page has been vandalized with nonsensical Latin. I have put a relevant tag. Someone please find time to revert vandalism.Cygnus_hansa (talk) 06:10, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

If you mean Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisicing elit... etc., that is standard filler used in many text and typesetting examples. See Lorem ipsum for the history. —EncMstr (talk) 06:26, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Tables acting different in different web browsers?

Do tables and images interact differently in different web browers? For example, on my userpage, in Opera and Firefox, the table on the right side of the page has no problems with the images being next to it. However, in Internet Explorer, it doesn't seem to want to let any of the images be next to it, and thus it tosses all of the content below it. Any thoughts to get around this? It's no big deal, but if fixable, would be nice. -- Natalya 12:41, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Header background

How to change the Header background from the default grey? Setting style="background" only changes the main content and not the header column(s). SunCreator (talk) 14:41, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Like this:

{| 
|- style="background: lightblue"
! Column 1
! Column 2
|- 
| Row 1
| Row 1
|}

Column 1	Column 2
Row 1	Row 1

Note that if you use class="wikitable" or some of the other table classes, the CSS overrides the header background. --— Gadget850 (Ed)talk 15:18, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Pipe syntax: no more than 2 single pipes on a line?

The pipe syntax tutorial, copied from WikiMedia, tells us: Just remember: no more than 2 single pipes on a line!

The following code exceeds that limit:

{|border="1"
|width="80" align="left"| <br />left<br /> ||width="80" align="center"|center||width="80" align="right"|right|width="80" align="center" valign="top"|top||width="80" align="center" valign="center"|center||width="80" align="center" valign="bottom"|bottom
|-align="center"
|style="background:Gainsboro"|Gainsboro||style="background:LightGray"|LightGray||style="background:Silver"|Silver||style="background:DarkGray"|DarkGray||style="background:Gray; color:white"|Gray||style="background:DimGray; color:white"|DimGray
|}

However, it produces the required results for me:

left	center	right|width="80" align="center" valign="top"|top	center	bottom
Gainsboro	LightGray	Silver	DarkGray	Gray	DimGray

Am I just misinterpreting the caveat, or is such code simply unreliable on specific platform/browser combinations? Alternatively, if the limitation has since been fixed, then perhaps we should amend the tutorial accordingly.

Thanks to anyone who can shed some light on this. --Error -128 (talk) 14:18, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

The double bars (||) are surrogate line breaks. I don't know if they were added later, which would explain why the rule was accurate at one time. —EncMstr (talk) 16:59, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Ah yes, EncMstr—that would explain the precise meaning of "line". Sorry for the dumb question; I'm thinking more clearly this morning. Thanks for the clarification. --Error -128 (talk) 06:18, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Fixed column widths need fixing?

I would be grateful if someone would help me out with the tables in List of Florida State University people. There are a lot of them, with or without a few illustration to the right, and each is a different size from the others, causing the page to look a bit sloppy. The obvious answer was to use fixed width columns. I, thus, tried beginning each table with code like this:

{| class="wikitable"
|-
| width="150pt"|Athlete
| width="550pt"|Notability
|-

The tables changed when I did that, but not all the same way! I'm obviously out of my depth, and some advice would really be great. Thanks. Tim Ross (talk) 10:33, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

You want "px" for pixels instead of "pt". --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 18:35, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Alternatively, if you want the column widths to scale with page width, use %: width="10%" —EncMstr (talk) 18:41, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Excellent! Thank you both very much. Tim Ross (talk) 21:32, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

I feel pretty incompetent, and apologize in advance for wasting someone's time, but I can not get either of the above methods to give me consistent tables. They each "seem" to work until I do a number of tables in a row and then compare them. They don't match when I do that. I would be extremely grateful if someone would edit the first 4 or 5 tables at List of Florida State University people so that they match. I'll happily repeat your method with the rest of the tables. Tim Ross (talk) 22:56, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

You might like to take a look at the current test in my sandbox, Tim; I've specified the width for the table as well as for each column:

{| class="wikitable" style="width:82%"

|-

! width="25%"| Alumni

! width="75%"| Notability

|-

While the results look fine here, they will depend on browser, screen resolution and other settings. I hope the approach improves things at your end, too—or at least helps you move a little further towards a solution. --Error -128 (talk) 02:00, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Perfect! Just what I was trying to achieve. Thanks, again, everyone. Tim Ross (talk) 10:22, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

text align a whole colum

Is there an easy way to align all items in a column to the right (or center) without needed to do it for each individual cell. I was thinking of using it on List of African countries and dependencies to get the numbers (area, pop, gdp) into the cetner, rather than left. Thanks Chris_huh^talk 14:58, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Chesapeake, Virginia

I cant seem to get 3 new things I added to the Chesapeake Page Table to save my life! I have Its Sister City, Highest and Lowest Points exactly like the orthers are! Im not missing nonthing and ITS FRUSTRATING ME!!! Can someone help? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wikiloli (talk • contribs) 15:57, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Tak ea a look at {{Infobox Settlement}}. There is no field for sister city, it is "twin1" and "twin1_country". Highest points is "elevation_max_m" or "elevation_max_ft", lowest is "elevation_min_m" or "elevation_min_ft". I fixed the city. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 16:54, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Table column not changing width?

Edit: nvm, its something wrong with firefox 3....ηoian ‡orever ηew ‡rontiers 20:11, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Was there a question? --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 20:13, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Originally, there was a table that was spaced horribly and I was trying to get the width things to work, and no matter what, it wouldn't change, and thought I wasn't doing it right cause I'm not experienced at tables (and asked someone to take a look at it at my sandbox, gone now)...the problem wasn't that I wasn't doing it right...Firefox v3 just wasn't showing the table width changes, showed up on IE......ηoian ‡orever ηew ‡rontiers 20:21, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Help needed

See the discussion at Talk:Timeline of chemical elements discoveries. I need too many columns and the table becomes cramped. If I try something like it has been suggested on the talkpage, then I cannot use the sort feature. Any suggestions? Nergaal (talk) 16:01, 14 July 2008 (UTC)

wikitables and HTML-style tables overlap each other in Firefox?

I find wikitables and HTML-style tables overlap each other in Firefox (2 or 3 2.0.0.16 in Vista). Here is an example.

In Firefox and Mozilla this HTML header text will be overlapped by the left hand wikitable
list1 text
list2 text
list3 text
list4 text
And some really, really, really, really wide list5 text

header 1 Firefox shows this wikitable overlapping the right hand table	header 2 HIER	header 3 ICI
row 1, cell 1, but Opera will keep them apart	row 1, cell 2	row 1, cell 3
row 2, cell 1 lorem ipsum blah abracadabra fie foe fum sur le pont	row 2, cell 2	row 2, cell 3

What I see with Firefox 2 or 3 2.0.0.16 or 1.0.6 or Netscape

I have asked about this on the Village pump .-84user (talk) 19:39, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Running FireFox 3 on XP. The second table is under the first as I would expect it. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 19:48, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. I am now running Firefox 3 on Vista and the tables display correctly. (I was mistaken when I wrote Firefox 3 above, I had upgraded to 2.0.0.16 somehow thinking that was 3!) So it seems this was a long-standing Firefox problem - I have reproduced it as far back as Firefox 1.0.6 on Damn Small Linux.-84user (talk) 20:48, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Interesting: On windows XP SP2 running FireFox 3.0.1, it looks fine, with one table above the other. On Linux (Fedora 8) running FireFox 2.0.0.16, the tables intersect, similar to the screenshot above. —EncMstr (talk) 21:19, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Text below and not next to a table

I have a question for the section of the article AC_power_plugs_and_sockets#Color_code: I want that the text of the next section begins below and not next to the table. How is it working? thanks in advance Martious 11:31, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Give me a bit. There is some odd stuff in that section, such as a TOC table. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 12:22, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Y The table was inside a table, there was a TOC table and there was some orphaned HTML table code. I'm not sure of the why, but I cleaned it out. I actually use that article at work when customers need a different power cable. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 13:21, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your work Martious 13:46, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Displaying Pipe in Table

How do you display a pipe in a table? The following code doesn't work.

{|
|-
!Token
!Meaning
|-
| \|\|
| Or
|-
| ||
| Another Or
|-
| \||
| Still Another Or
|-
| &&
| And
|}

Token	Meaning
\|	Or
		Another Or
\		Still Another Or
&&	And

Stephen Rasku (talk) 17:52, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

You can use template {{!}}. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 17:59, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Wrapping text around a wikitable

Hi. I'm just wondering how do you right align a wikitable and then get the text to wrap around it. At the moment, the text I am writing just goes below the table which looks awful. ManfromDelmonte (talk) 00:02, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

See Help:Table#Floating table. If the table is wide, you might want to limit its width for a decent looking result. —EncMstr (talk) 00:42, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

That worked perfectly. Glad you answered that! Wadester16 (talk) 02:06, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Multiple tables aligned next to each other

Is there any real way in aligning 2 different tables right next to each other??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Parra-Power (talk • contribs) 08:11, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Sure, just put both tables inside another table.

outer table col 1	outer table col 2
t2 c1 t2 c2 left table left table some data some data	t3 c1 t3 c2 right table right table more data more data

The outer table needn't be visible like I made it. In the wikitext, omit the class and the ! title lines for the outer table. —EncMstr (talk) 08:58, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

The short way to do that is to use one of the {{column}} templates. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 11:20, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Default Hidden

Hello, Does anyone know how to code making the table start hidden as default? It's been requested in my GA review on Minnesota Golden Gophers men's basketball that I make the season year-by-year records as default hidden, and I couldn't find it on the main help page. Thanks! matt91486 (talk) 21:46, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Table inside a list

I want to convert this table into a wiki markup, because I see no reason why it should be a picture, but I don't know how to do it and don't break that list, beacause {| has to be on its own line and that excludes it from the list. How should I solve that? Svick (talk) 12:29, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

[1]

the 'position' property can be used for that. (yes, I realize this question is over a month old) -- 6Sixx (talk) 11:01, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

• Thanks, I should have thought of something like that. Svick (talk) 23:49, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

Row ranks in sorted tables

Wanted: a table that is sortable on several columns, and where the sorted table includes a column showing the ranking according to the chosen sort key. See Talk:Federal subjects of Russia#the extra table. -- Jao (talk) 01:23, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

Wikitable help

Just a question, but I need some help regarding the tables seen here:

List of The Border characters and Characters of Lost.

What I noted is that in the List of The Border characters page, there is a line at the rightmost portion of the table. While at the Characters of Lost page, there is none. I'm wondering if there is a way to fix it? Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.58.43.77 (talk • contribs) 25 November 2008, 20:43:55 (UTC)

I don't see anything amiss. Can you describe the problem more specifically—or upload a screenshot (must log in to do that)? —EncMstr (talk) 20:48, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

If you are using FireFox, reset the zoom (ctl 0). FireFox renders tables badly when you zoom out. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 21:45, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

Here.

http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/48/screen1zd6.jpg

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/3931/screen2rd1.jpg

The top one shows the chart with a bar at the rightmost part. The bottom one shows no bar at the rightmost part of the chart.

Ominae (talk) 23:45, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I still don't see any problem. Do you mean the rightmost vertical line which closes the right edge of the table? It appears in both images, so I doubt that's what you mean. Both images are 1736 pixels wide, but I notice the second one has some whitespace (10–20 pixels) outside the table. —EncMstr (talk) 00:00, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

At the topmost screencap, a vertical line is traveling downwards. Not the one at the edge. The bottom screencap doesn't have it. Ominae (talk) 01:35, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

I see vertical lines at the right of the table in both your screenshots. It is gray at the edge from the top of the table to the bottom. They match those at the left edges. Both sets of vertical lines enclose the table with gray lines. Is that what you mean? —EncMstr (talk) 07:43, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Yea. Ominae (talk) 04:35, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Need help with table

on the Ukrainian national ice hockey team article, I'm trying to include the player's statistics beside their biographical information. Well....I'm having a bitch of a time doing it, seem to have screwed up somewhere. How do I get those stats to line up correctly with the header I've already placed adjacent? (GP|W|L|T| etc.)

thanks

I don't see any attempts in the history to add them. However, I think this is what you mean. Starting with the first part of the table, you have:

Name	Hometown	First	Club
Goaltenders										GP	W	L	T	GAA	SV%
Konstantin Simchuk	Kyiv	1997	Sibir Novosibirsk
Oleksander Fedorov	Kyiv	2005	Sokil Kyiv
Igor Karpenko	Kyiv	1995	Sokil Kyiv
Vadim Seliverstov	Kyiv	2007	Sokil Kyiv

Just refactor the table and add the data like this:

Name	Hometown	First	Club	GP	W	L	T	GAA	SV%
Goaltenders
Konstantin Simchuk	Kyiv	1997	Sibir Novosibirsk	100	101	102	103	104	105
Oleksander Fedorov	Kyiv	2005	Sokil Kyiv	106	107	109	109	110	111
Igor Karpenko	Kyiv	1995	Sokil Kyiv	200	201	202	203	204	205
Vadim Seliverstov	Kyiv	2007	Sokil Kyiv	206	207	209	209	210	211

Is that what you were looking for? —EncMstr (talk) 19:15, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

yes, close, but i wanted to be able to have the 3 separate stat-headers, since goaltenders have different stat abbreviations. i guess i could make a header table and 3 separate tables afterwards...but it would be inefficient--Lvivske (talk) 00:56, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

That rather violates the intent of a table: a grid with consistent rows and columns. It would be more two the point with two different tables, one for goaltenders and the other for non-goaltenders. —EncMstr (talk) 02:38, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

I just wanted to keep the widths the same, keep things uniform. I guess I could do what you said.--Lvivske (talk) 03:19, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

Go ahead and make your edits, but don't do anything to make the column widths consistent. Notify me here or on my talk page when you're done and I'll fix the column widths for you. —EncMstr (talk) 05:03, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

Help with bolding row lines

I am looking for code to bold individual row lines between two major divisions on User:Wildhartlivie/Tables#Awards combined. What I want to do is bold just the lines between the changes in column 1 (awards). I'm not working it out and would love some help. Thanks. Wildhartlivie (talk) 15:17, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Here's an example of several extra large row and column lines. If examining the wikitext doesn't elucidate, please ask.

hdr1	hdr2
row 1, col 1	row 1, col 2
row 2, col 1	row 2, col 2
row 3, col 1	row 3, col 2
row 4, col 1	row 4, col 2

—EncMstr (talk) 18:11, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks so much. It helped immensely! Wildhartlivie (talk) 20:34, 13 December 2008 (UTC)