Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Wranglers of the University of Cambridge

The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by User:Scorpion0422 01:14, 29 September 2008 [1].

List of Wranglers of the University of Cambridge edit

Created as a jumping off point, as there are a large number of notable people who have been either Senior or Second Wrangler. The list is complete with all records from the University archives. Mrh30 (talk) 13:13, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Support. It seems to satisfy all the necessary criteria: the prose is grammatically correct, it has an informative introductory section, it's comprehensive, well-structured, complies with the Manual of Style, it's visually clear and makes appropriate use of portraits and other pictures, and it's not under dispute. -- Nicholas Jackson (talk) 13:26, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from The Rambling Man (talk) 16:43, 20 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments - not exactly compliant with the criteria nor the MOS yet, but a few comments will help it on its way.

Don't like the title much - perhaps "List of Wranglers of the University of Cambridge" or similar - the parentheses in the title are undesirable really. Done
"This is a list of the people..." - we've moved away from starting featured list content like this. See some of the recently promoted FLs for some ideas. Done
Is a wrangler capitalised or not? The title of the list capitalises it while the first sentence of the lead doesn't. The article about wranglers here on Wikipedia doesn't appear to capitalise wrangler, nor senior/second wrangler. Done

The official University records capitalise the word, so I am standardising on that. Mrh30 (talk) 14:04, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Non experts are unlikely to know what a Mathematics Tripos is - I know you've linked it but you could explain it here too, especially since the lead is so short. Done
"but went on to great things after graduating" - not encyclopedic, very much POV. Stick to the facts. Done
Is there a reason that order-of-merit is hyphenated here? Most other places I see order of merit without hyphenation. Done
You mention Optimes at the end of the lead without explaining it. Done
As you've split the table, it renders the sorting a little redundant - I'd merge the tables. Done
If you insist of keeping the tables separate, make the columns from table to table the same width. Done (no need to do anything now!)
Names should sort by surname, especially as you have a number of wranglers without known forenames, so you should look at using the {{sortname}} template. Done
MOS breach - image captions which are sentence fragments should not have a full stop. Done
MOS breach - references with page ranges should use the en-dash, not the hyphen to separate them, per WP:DASH. Done
Portrait images should take the upright parameter per WP:MOS#Images. Done
Any reason not to link the colleges? Done
Was Caius still Caius and not Gonville and Caius for all their wrangling success? Done

I've used Caius as this is the common name for the college. Several of the colleges either technically change names (Catharine Hall -> St Catharine's) or are known by a name that's different to their 'real' name (Jesus). I guess putting in the linking overcomes this issue? Mrh30 (talk) 14:12, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I think the full name of the college at the time of the award of the wranglership, linked, should be used. The Rambling Man (talk) 14:23, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I see where you're coming from, and in most cases this is probably the best thing to do. The problem is that no-one is going to understand what you're talking about when you quote the name of a college as being 'The College of the Blessed Virgin Mary, Saint John the Evangelist and the glorious Virgin Saint Radegund, near Cambridge' and it arguably adds less to the article than calling it by the name everyone knows it by (and indeed is the title of its article) Jesus College, Cambridge. Mrh30 (talk) 14:32, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, compromise - add a footnote? You say it's the name "everyone knows it by" - Jesus I'll give you, Caius, perhaps not. It takes a little of being "in-the-know" to realise that most Tabs drop Mr Gonville... how many tourists, without their guidebook, would know that? The Rambling Man (talk) 14:34, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've started hyperlinking. I'll go with whatever is the current WP article title. So Caius become G&C, whereas Jesus stays as it is. Mrh30 (talk) 14:41, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

1792 - Palmer - is that St John's? Done
You have multiple winners of some positions so the col headings should be wrangler(s), right? Done
The lead could take advantage of the fact that St John's and Trinity seemed to lead the way in this. Done

That's all I have for now. The Rambling Man (talk) 13:52, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments - sources look okay. Can't check links as the link checker tool is down. Ealdgyth - Talk 14:25, 19 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Cmments

Put the table in its own section Done
{{clear}} the first image so that it doesn't squeeze the table to the left

This surely isn't a problem once the section heading is added? Mrh30 (talk) 07:03, 21 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Gary King (talk) 21:14, 20 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Weak support

I think the lead is still a little weak for a list of such magnitude.

I've expanded it further, giving some more justification for the significance of the list, and the people in it. Is it heading the right way? Mrh30 (talk) 08:47, 25 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I think it is. The Rambling Man (talk) 09:06, 25 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Would you like any more? I'm just wary of it becomming waffly and overlapping with Wrangler (University of Cambridge). Mrh30 (talk) 09:22, 25 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It's fine now in my opinion. Cheers. The Rambling Man (talk) 09:32, 25 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Some captions link the Wrangler, some don't - be consistent. Done
Don't like in-line links as you have for footnotes 8, 11 and 15 - any chance you could reformat them per {{cite web}} or similar?

They're already using cite web. I'm not clear what you would like changed about them. Do you just want me to put a few more details into the template (accessdate etc)? Mrh30 (talk) 08:30, 25 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That would be preferable. The Rambling Man (talk) 09:06, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Done[reply]

The Rambling Man (talk) 17:29, 24 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.