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Template:Did you know nominations/Kiringul

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The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by BlueMoonset (talk) 05:02, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

Kiringul edit

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Created/expanded by Kelapstick (talk), LadyofShalott (talk), Prioryman (talk). Nominated by Kelapstick (talk) at 12:02, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

  • ALT 3: How about, '... that the discovery of a unicorn lair near Pyongyang is said to be giving Kim Jong-un "the legitimacy he lacks"?' I don't know if there might be an issue with referring to the Korean Supreme Leader in that manner on the main page though. Ryan Vesey 13:20, 5 December 2012 (UTC)
  • I would be fine with that to (depending on the legitimacy comment on the main page) although it implies that it actually a unicorn lair, and not just a rock with "unicorn lair" carved on it. I am fine with either. --kelapstick(bainuu) 14:11, 5 December 2012 (UTC)
  • I'm good with either the original or any of the 4 alts. --kelapstick(bainuu) 10:58, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
  • I have just read this as an outside observer. The names are not regularized. The lead has unsourced claims that are not expanded or explained in the text. The POV is obvious and unbalanced. This needs a lot of work. μηδείς (talk) 05:25, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
  • I've done some work to try to address the issues you've raised, except I don't understand what you mean by "the names are not regularized". I believe they are spelled consistently and in a manner reflective of the sources. If you mean something else, or I've missed something, please explain. LadyofShalott 01:04, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
One obvious issue is that King Tongmyong and King Dongmyeong refer to the same person, but use a different Romanization in each rendering. (This is like Mao Tse-tung and Mao Zedong in English, both the same dictator.) This will be confusing to readers. Unfortunately, I am quite ignorant on the topic, so this will need the attention of someone with a familiarity with Korean which I don't have. μηδείς (talk) 01:16, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
OK, I do feel rather silly for not spotting that. I'll ask the Korea project for advice/help.LadyofShalott 01:29, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
Help requested. LadyofShalott 01:40, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
As a editor of the Korean WikiProject, I looked over the article and made the associated romanization changes. I believe the article title, and the associated intro text, should be moved to match the "Dongmyeong" romanization though I did not do this myself as it is more difficult to revert. Since I am no expert, I wouldn't mind if someone else from the Project also had the opportunity to look over my changes. Michaelcomella (talk) 18:46, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
  • I added an issue on the article's Talk Page to change the usage of "unicorn" to "Qilin" as I believe it's more accurate (though the cited sources say otherwise). Please read more (and discuss) there. Michaelcomella (talk) 18:49, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
  • The article has not been touched for two weeks, since the above December 22 edits. If this is going to proceed, and the naming has been decided to be Dongmyeong, then the article needs to be renamed, all instances of "Tongmyong" in it (except for one to give it as the alternate transliteration) need to be changed, and the hooks here adjusted as well to use the new transliteration. Also, the unicorn/Qilin issue needs to be settled as it also affects the article name (is it always capitalized, or should it be lowercase when used?); if it's "Qilin" instead of "unicorn" then most of the hooks become useless, as hardly anyone knows what a Qilin is. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:01, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
  • I am in transit for a few days, on my way to work (yes it does take me days to get to work) I won't be able to look at it for probably another week. Having said that every source I looked at when writing it says unicorn including the dprk source,it may be a poor translation, but that is what it said. The person who's unicorn it was (typing on my phone so please bare with me) was piped so the article matched the source, but bypassed a redirect to the Wikipedia article title spelling. The title is capitalized because that is what was done in he dprk source, but I really don't care one way or another. I have been on holidays (and away from a proper computer) for about 4 weeks and haven't been able to address these concerns, hope to shortly, if nobody else does before me. --kelapstick(bainuu) 18:21, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

←I have changed it all to Dongmyeong, and put in a note about the Romanization and have lowercased the unicorn. As I have said before, all sources refer to it as a "unicorn", poor translation is not for us to decide. I have also changed the hooks to reflect the new name. Anything I am missing? --kelapstick(bainuu) 04:25, 12 January 2013 (UTC)

  • Needs full review now that the issues raised above have been addressed. (Fixed formatting of two ALTs.) BlueMoonset (talk) 15:49, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
  • I started reviewing this and then realised I wasn't happy with the article at all; it wasn't a unicorn and it wasn't a lair, and the premise of the article appears to have been based on a mistranslation. I've completely rewritten the article and moved it to Kiringul. I'd suggest the following hook for it. Prioryman (talk) 23:27, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
  • Just so you know, Prioryman, DYK templates should not be renamed. (This one wasn't renamed after the article's first new name.) That's what the DYKmake template's subpage parameter is for: to point at the original, actual name of the template no matter how many article renames there may be. Hopefully, nothing will break, but as it says at T:TDYK#How to move a nomination subpage to a new name: "Don't". Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:04, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
  • Needs a new, full review given the major changes to the article; as Prioryman did the rewriting, he's now a contributor and can't continue as reviewer. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:53, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
  • Prioryman has done an excellent job rewriting the article and giving the discovery of the cave and the subsequent critical reaction due weight. The article meets DYK rules for a 5-day window of nominating (from when the article was posted on December 4), is long enough, well-referenced, and does not have close paraphrasing with the sources. QPQ done. The ALT5 hook is hooky and verified by the sources. ALT5 is good to go. Yoninah (talk) 13:15, 23 January 2013 (UTC)
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