Talk:Baudet du Poitou

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Poitou donkey/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Sasata (talk · contribs) 01:22, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Review in the next few days. Sasata (talk) 01:22, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Looks pretty good, just a few nitpicks, and some possibly useful sources from a lit search. Sasata (talk) 03:42, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

• link mule, mechanization, conservation, riding, driving, breeding farm, registering body (to breed registry?)
• probably don't need the article title in the image caption if there's also an identical header
• "… and the 19th and early 20th centuries saw them being used for the production of mules throughout Europe and contributing to other donkey breeds." perhaps you could spell that last part out more explicitly? I presume it has to to do with breeding?
• "Conservation efforts were begun, among a number of public and private breeders and organizations," don't think the 1st comma is needed
• asses or donkeys? are they completely interchangeable? Why not stick to one?
• "the breed played a smaller role in the creation of the breed than some breeders liked." reword to remove a "breed"?
• "In 1979, the Haras Nationaux (French National Stud) and the Parc Naturel Regional du Marais Poitevin, working with private breeders, to launch an effort to improve the genetics of the Poitou, develop new breeding techniques and collect traditional knowledge on the breed." grammar issues

• I think I have addressed everything above this point. Please let me know if there is anything I missed or that needs further work. I'll begin working on the sourcing points below shortly. Thanks for the review! Dana boomer (talk) 14:35, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

• according to this source, "Without proper registration and a microchip, no donkey may claim the name Poitou, and must be called a Poitou-type."

• This is a self-published book by a non-SME, so I'm wary of using it as a source. I did find a source (now integrated) that states that microchipping has been used in the breed, but haven't yet come across a source that says it's required. Dana boomer (talk) 15:26, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

• this source says that about 30,000 mules were produced annually in the years shortly before WWII. There's also some discussion about a possible relationship between the Poitou and the "American Standard" mule (is this related to the American Mammoth Jack mentioned in the article?)

• American donkeys are generally categorized by size, rather than having specific breeds, so the basic difference between an AMJ and an AS is height. I have this book in paper copy, and while a fun read, it's a bit...fluffy. I can't find a source I consider really reliable that backs up the idea that Poitous made up a significant portion of the donkey stock in the US. I've found a bit more information on the Poitou imports to the US in a more solid source (which basically says there weren't that many, and that they were not bred pure for very long, if at all), and have added it in. The 30,000 number is already in the history section, in the second paragraph (after the block quote). I've added a bit more about their popularity during this period, however. Dana boomer (talk) 15:26, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

• there's some interesting historical material presented in the 1883 article "Mule breeding in Poiout"

• Integrated. Dana boomer (talk) 17:04, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

• From the abstract: "The anatomy of the uterus neck of the donkey differs from that of the mare, not only by its size but also by the existence of an important vaginal eminence and by the presence of clear mucosal folds which are connected to the open flower arrangement of the caudal part of the uterus neck and form dorsal and ventral frenulums with respect to the latter."

Title: Some aspects on the anatomy of the uterus neck of the Baudet du Poitou donkey breed.

Author(s): Guintard, C; Vendramini, OM; Tainturier, D

Source: REVUE DE MEDECINE VETERINAIRE Volume: 147 Issue: 8-9 Pages: 599-& Published: AUG-SEP 1996

• Is this discussing general differences between horses and donkeys, or is it discussing differences between the Poitou and other donkeys? The former seems more suited to the main horse and donkey articles. The latter, unless there are some major overall differences, seems a bit specific for a general-coverage article.

• "Five (out of ten tested) animals from "Baudet du Poitou" breed presented an abnormality : their karyotype is characterized by a partial deletion of the p arm of one chromosome n(o) 1 and by a telomeric extra-material on the p arm of one chromosome n(o) 4. A partial translocation between these two chromosomes is hypothesized."

Title: Cytogenetic study on two populations of donkeys. Discovery of a chromosomal abnormality in Baudet du Poitou

Author(s): Darre, A; Berland, MH; Seguela, A; et al.

Source: REVUE DE MEDECINE VETERINAIRE Volume: 149 Issue: 3 Pages: 233-238 Published: MAR 1998

• I can't see this article, but it sounds interesting. Not exactly a huge sample population, but a sentence or two would probably be appropriate. Do you hav eaccess to this? Dana boomer (talk) 17:04, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

• Don't know if you might want to double up a citation, but the following article supports the statement about frozen semen (I have access if you'd like to read it):

Title: A procedure for Poitou jackass sperm cryopreservation

Author(s): Trimeche, A; Renard, P; Tainturier, D

Source: THERIOGENOLOGY Volume: 50 Issue: 5 Pages: 793-806 DOI: 10.1016/S0093-691X(98)00184-8 Published: OCT 1 1998

• I found another source that backs up the frozen semen thing. Is there other information it this article that would be pertinent to include? If so, I'd love to see it. Dana boomer (talk) 17:04, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

• also check out PMID 12224447

• This sounds quite interesting, but again, I don't have access. Do you? Dana boomer (talk) 17:04, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Thank you very much for the review. I've integrated quite a bit of new information into the history section, as well as making the prose tweaks you suggested above. Dana boomer (talk) 17:04, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for e-mailing the studies. I integrated a bit from the cryopreservation ref, though there wasn't much there. From what I can get out of Google Translate for the German ref, they were basically just making sure that their testing method would work on donkeys - apparently it was previously used in horses and so they weren't sure it would test properly in donkeys. The discussion of Poitous specifically, from what I could tell, was basically "they're rare and, as such, in danger of being inbred". Well, yeah, duh :) With this done, I think I've addressed everything above? Dana boomer (talk) 19:29, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

You certainly have. All images are appropriately licensed, and I think all of the other GA criteria are met. Promoting article now. Sasata (talk) 19:48, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Thank you very much! I especially appreciate the literature search - you always manage to come across articles that I don't...! Dana boomer (talk) 20:36, 23 March 2013 (UTC)