Talk:Bart Gunn

Last Name

I've only ever seen his real name as "Plotcheck," and that's how it was spelled in his MMA debut. I'd assume he would have given ROTR the correct name, especially since he's never used "Plotcheck" as a stage name. Do you have an authority for "Polchlopek" as his last name? I think this needs a citation; otherwise, it should be reverted. If it's really "Polchlopek," however, we should move the article.

Requested move (2006)

The following is a closed discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was no consensus. Including the nominator, there are two support votes and two oppose votes. It would have been nice to have more participation, but it's been almost two weeks. -- Kjkolb 06:23, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Mike Plotcheck → Mike Barton – "Mike Barton" is the name Plotcheck has wrestled and fought under for the last several years. "Mike Barton" returns 61,000 Google search results, whereas "Mike Plotcheck" returns just 678. McPhail 21:12, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Survey

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your opinion with ~~~~

• Oppose - I prefer continuing to index wrestlers under their real names, not their characters' names. Plus, you can't really talk about his MMA career under "Mike Barton"; Mike Barton isn't an MMA fighter, Mike Plotcheck is. Tuckdogg 21:28, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
• Oppose, While I disagree with what is said below, if he does MMA under his real name, we should keep it there.--Darren Jowalsen 23:00, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
• Support(Halbared 13:03, 12 July 2006 (UTC))

Discussion

Add any additional comments

The issue here is really one of who we are discussing: are we discussing Mike Barton the character, or are we discussing Mike Plotcheck, the man who plays the character Mike Barton (and has played other characters throughout his career)? While wrestlers are not generally identified as "actors" per se, in reality, they are. If you wanted to talk about George Clooney, you wouldn't call the article Doug Ross. Doug Ross is just a character Clooney once played, as Plotcheck has played Mike Barton, Bart Gunn, etc. For the sake of clarity, it should always be best practice to index wrestlers under their real names and not their character names. The character names should redirect to the real name pages of the wrestler who played them, unless separate pages are being created for some reason for that particular character. E.g. creating a "Kane (wrestling)" page, wherein one might discuss the sordid and convoluted history of the "Kane" character (if such a thing is possible...), while maintaining the page for Glen Jacobs to discuss Jacobs' entire career. Tuckdogg 23:26, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

• I really think he should be listed under Mike Barton and/or Bart Gunn only. The dispute between his last name could go on and on, without a clear answer (since I doubt anyone can just ask him with no problem or whatever). RobJ1981 22:23, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Erm...not really. I doubt the dispute over his last name will continue. He was billed at Rumble on the Rock under his real name, and he gave them Mike Plotcheck. I think the man knows his own name. He doesn't own Bart Gunn, and can't legally use it, so that name's out. Mike Barton he owns, but he does not use the name outside of wrestling. It's a character name and nothing more. The page should stay where it is. Tuckdogg 01:13, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one article was rated and this bot brought all the other ratings up to at least that level. BetacommandBot 23:58, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Problem with sources for "Polchlopek" name.

Reference #2 merely says Michal Polchlopek III was the son of Michal Polchlopek Jr. It does NOT say Michal Polchlopek Jr. is "Bart Gunn". Reference #21 (referring to the shooting of Polchlopek III) is a dead link, redirecting to the website's current front page, so it can neither confirm or deny anything. To hold up against evidence (from Sherdog) that "Bart Gunn" is, in fact, Mike Plotcheck, this article will need sources that clearly state he is Polchlopek, not just that a man named Polchlopek exists. I'll give some time for discussion and sourcing before I change all "Polchlopek"s to "Plotcheck". — Preceding unsigned comment added by InedibleHulk (talk • contribs) 23:21, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

I've searched the Google News archive for "Michal Polchlopek" in conjuction with "Bart Gunn", "Mike Barton" and "wrestler" (without quotes). No results for any combination. Regular Google returns links from forums, blogs and unreliable wrestling "newz" sites, which cite the same sources Wikipedia does. Neither source makes any mention of Bart Gunn, any of his aliases, or any connection at all to wrestling. There is no reason I can see to leave either the "fact" that Bart Gunn is Polchlopek, or that his son was shot in this article, until sourced. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:47, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Requested Move (2012)

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved -- JHunterJ (talk) 12:21, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

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Mike Polchlopek → Mike Plotcheck – No sources given in article identify "Bart Gunn" as Michal Polchlopek. Sherdog identifies "Bart Gunn" as Mike Plotcheck. Nothing is found in Google News Archives linking gunshot victim Michal Polchlopek III with "Bart Gunn". InedibleHulk (talk) 00:27, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

So we're clear, this was the reference used to support his "Polchlopek" name before I removed it. http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/floridatoday/obituary.aspx?page=lifestory&pid=99915819 As you can see, this only says SOMEONE named "Michal Polchlopek Jr." is the father of of this dead boy. It does not state this someone's alias.

Mike Plotcheck (who is clearly the same person as "Bart Gunn") has competed in licensed MMA events, which require fighters to be licensed. Providing false information on a licence application (his name) is illegal in many (if not all) sanctioning body rulebooks. There have been no reports of disciplinary action against Plotcheck, which strongly suggests his application was truthful. InedibleHulk (talk) 02:04, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

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Move Mike Plotcheck back to Mike Polchlopek

The move that was done on 4/28/12 was not a correct move. The wrestler/MMA fighter known as Bart Gunn and Mike Barton is Michael Polchlopek. Clearly all this pictures are the same person - Michael Polchlopek NOT Plotcheck

Below are examples over the years to high school forward

High School Yearbook Pictures

Class of 1981 Titusville High School Yearbook: http://www.classmates.com/yearbooks/Titusville-High-School/165544?page=160

Class of 1981 Titusville High School Yearbook: http://www.classmates.com/yearbooks/Titusville-High-School/165544?page=96

Class of 1981 Titusville High School Yearbook (wrestling team): http://www.classmates.com/yearbooks/Titusville-High-School/165544?page=48

IWF (International Wrestling Federation):

http://images-mediawiki-sites.thefullwiki.org/10/2/5/7/34136782594731955.jpg

WWE

http://i479.photobucket.com/albums/rr160/fishbulb-suplex/Wrestlers/Tag%20Teams/Smoking%20Gunns/Smoking_Gunns_02.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/90/Smoking_Bart_Gunn_in_Birmingham.jpg/220px-Smoking_Bart_Gunn_in_Birmingham.jpg

MMA

http://www.tapology.com/system/letterbox_images/1395/default/Plotcheck-Mike-PrideB13-1.jpg?1276123548

Current

http://www.flickr.com/photos/woodmo/3475450474/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Techsupportdude (talk • contribs) 03:06, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

I can't see the pictures without registering, but even if they prove something, this is clearly synthesis. InedibleHulk (talk) 04:23, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

Here are the pictures:

http://i1340.photobucket.com/albums/o722/Reaper_House/Mike2-1.jpg

http://i1340.photobucket.com/albums/o722/Reaper_House/mike4.jpg

http://i1340.photobucket.com/albums/o722/Reaper_House/mike3-1.jpg

This is not the same thing as "systhesis" - it is looking at a picture from a reliable source and you could compare it to any source that you feel is reliable and you would see it is the same person. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Techsupportdude (talk • contribs) 15:08, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

"Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources." In this case, the material is a picture captioned "Mike Polchlopek" and any other picture captioned "Bart Gunn" or "Mike Barton". That "Danny Ferguson" guy looks like Ted McGinley to me, but it would be original research to say he is Ted McGinley. Yes, you have a better case than that, but the essence of the rule is the same. For what it's worth, "Polchlopek" is a far more common name in general than "Plotcheck", if Google's any indication. What you say seems like it could be true. But it needs to be verifiable, by Wikipedia's standards.

This is an interesting case, and I think there may be some solution that satisfies everyone. However, I can't think of it offhand. Perhaps you'd like to request comments from other (perhaps wiser) editors? This article's talk page doesn't get many visitors, and you'll need some sort of consensus to move. InedibleHulk (talk) 06:40, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Polchlopek Not Plotcheck

Sources for move back to the correct name spelling:

http://www.ufc.com/fighter/Ikuhisa-Minowa

http://espn.go.com/mma/fighter/_/id/2951365/mike-polchlopek

www.fightmetric.com: http://hosteddb.fightmetric.com/fighters/details/684 (The name Mike Barton is shown under his real name because he is known by that name in Japan to wrestling fans.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/mma/fighters/Mike_Polchlopek/

Bleacher report news article on Minowa: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/299687-ikuhisa-minowa-the-top-ten-freakshows/page/6

MMA Site: http://www.tapology.com/fightcenter/fighters/mike-polchlopek-bart-gunn

Techsupportdude (talk) 17:12, 22 January 2013 (UTC)Techsupportdude

Polchlopek not Plotcheck

http://www.wwe.com/classics/wherearetheynow/where-are-they-now-bart-gunn-26116820

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: move. -- tariqabjotu 03:54, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

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Mike Plotcheck → Mike Polchlopek – Name has been explicitly verified by the WWE.com source above, as well as suggested by other sources above that. Redirect at proposed page preventing move. InedibleHulk (talk) 09:13, 9 August 2013 (UTC) 09:13, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

• Support - The WWE source, as well as the spelling of his name on his IMDB page, should be enough to warrant a move. Luchuslu (talk) 12:47, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
• Support - Seems our current title is incorrect.LM2000 (talk) 02:50, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

Why not Bart Gunn?--HHH Pedrigree (talk) 18:29, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

Because of Mike Barton. And his bit of MMA as Mike Plotcheck. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:36, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

I think that his common name is Bart Gunn. He spent years in one of the largest promotions as Bart Gunn, several Tag team Championships as Bart Gunn, a notable Tag Team and the Brawl for All.--HHH Pedrigree (talk) 21:10, 13 August 2013 (UTC)

Sure, but Mike Barton was a tag champ in All Japan, another of the largest promotions where he spent years. Beating Steve Williams in a shoot was met with "Let's never have another one of these again" from the US fans, and "Holy fuck, he just whooped the toughest American ever!" from the Japanese (generally speaking). Too close to call on the ring names. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:28, 14 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, but when I asked for a name change John Laurinaitis -> Johnny Ace, some people said that WWE has more global exposure than AJPW.--HHH Pedrigree (talk) 13:20, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

It's not an exact science, but we also must consider how they were presented in each promotion (see Bad News Allen and Jesse Barr). In All Japan, Ace was a solid midcarder and four-time tag champ, but in WWE, Laurinaitis was the GM of both shows, whose storylines revolved around him in a major way. Also headlined a PPV (maybe two, I forget). I'd still have favoured "Johnny Ace", but there was also the problem of another Johnny Ace existing. And there's the fact that Laurinaitis isn't just a ring name, but the actual person's.

Also, given how the world has YouTube now, the global exposure argument isn't quite as strong as it was during their careers. InedibleHulk (talk) 17:17, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move (2014)

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: no consensus. Jenks24 (talk) 14:29, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

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Mike Polchlopek → Bart Gunn – This is the ring name used by Polchlopek during his longest continuous period of global exposure. His appearances as Mike Barton were primarily in Japan, so he is not well known by this name to an English-speaking audience. This will allow far more direct linking. A Google News Archive search returns three hits for "Bart Gunn" and zero for "Mike Polchlopek". --Relisted. ^walk victor falk ^talk 16:32, 24 May 2014 (UTC)McPhail (talk) 21:01, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

• Support as nominator. He is definitely not best known by the name "Mike Polchlopek", so having the page at this title doesn't help anyone. McPhail (talk) 21:04, 1 May 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose Another case of two rather equal names colliding, and us using the name common to both. Wrestling is a universal language, and there's plenty of New Japan (and other) on YouTube (and other). Japanese people also speak English, often enough, and may well be reading this. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:17, 1 May 2014 (UTC)
  • Polchlopek has never performed on television in the western world as "Mike Barton". He performed on global television as "Bart Gunn" for several years. For users of the English-speaking Wikipedia, he will unquestionably be better known as "Bart Gunn". McPhail (talk) 19:40, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

Sure, but the Western world has more than television. Plenty have likely read about and seen Barton on the Internet (like right now) and magazines. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:46, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

• Support. He was known as Bart Gunn during what remains his widest exposure. oknazevad (talk) 01:10, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
• Comment He had a small MMA career under a third name. Something to consider, wrasslin' aside. InedibleHulk (talk) 03:17, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose Especially since he uses multiple ring names we should stay with his real name. Redirects with the various ring names should take care of any search issues.Peter Rehse (talk) 17:40, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
  • Having the page at "Mike Polchlopek" as a compromise is at odds with WP:AT. It isn't recognizable and it isn't natural. McPhail (talk) 19:40, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
    • No, the general practice of using real names isn't at odds with WP:AT. Generally, the most reliable academic sources will tend to refer to wrestlers by their legal names. The practice of using real names is a variant of COMMONNAME which chooses to accord more weight to more reliable sources. Xoloz (talk) 18:13, 7 June 2014 (UTC)
• Support: Enough with unrecognisable article titles. No doubt, WWF has had more international exposure than any Japanese promotion. He's even used Bart Gunn in Japan with All Japan Pro Wrestling. So what if people can watch Mike Barton on the Internet? They can also watch Bart Gunn on the Internet. Cancels each other out. starship.paint "YES!" 10:39, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose When in doubt, use legal names. Admist a sea of ever-changing and conflicting ring personae, legal names are constant referents to which the most reliable sources resort. Xoloz (talk) 18:13, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

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External links modified

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Orphaned references in Mike Polchlopek

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Mike Polchlopek's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "puroresufan.com":

• From Jim Steele (wrestler): http://www.puroresufan.com/njpw/results/fspirit03.html
• From Tencozy: http://www.puroresufan.com/njpw/results/notes/fspirit00.html

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT⚡ 14:40, 6 July 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 4 external links on Mike Polchlopek. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

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• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20131227151314/http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldtagteam/3044541321215 to http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldtagteam/3044541321215
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20121018161330/http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldtagteam/30445413212213 to http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldtagteam/30445413212213
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140319105757/http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldtagteam/30445413212132 to http://www.wwe.com/classics/titlehistory/worldtagteam/30445413212132

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DOB

His date of birth at OWW refers to December 27, 1965 not 1963. http://www.onlineworldofwrestling.com/bios/m/mike-barton/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abuissa2w334 (talk • contribs) 04:19, 11 March 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 23 September 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: (non-admin closure) MOVED per unanimous agreement among participants that this stage name is the most common name. User:力 (power~enwiki, π, ν) 23:35, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

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Mike Polchlopek → Bart Gunn – WP:COMMONNAME. He is best know to the people as Bart Gunn. Despite working under other names, he worked as Bart Gunn during the Attitude Era and the New Generation era. Also, recently he appeared at Dark Side of the Ring and was credited as Bart Gunn. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 20:40, 23 September 2021 (UTC)— Relisting. Havelock Jones (talk) 07:57, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

• Support per nom. ♡RAFAEL♡^(talk) 16:16, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
• Support - since the time of the prior RM, this appears to clearly be the common name he has settled on. TiggerJay (talk) 06:37, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.