Talk:Lechmere station

Requested move 1 May 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: consensus to move the pages at this time, per the discussion below. Please assist in creating any new redirects that may prove helpful. Dekimasuよ! 04:49, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

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• Lechmere (MBTA station) → Lechmere station
• Arlington (MBTA station) → Arlington station (MBTA)
• Babcock Street (MBTA station) → Babcock Street station
• Back of the Hill (MBTA station) → Back of the Hill station
• Ball Square (MBTA station) → Ball Square station
• Blandford Street (MBTA station) → Blandford Street station
• Boston University Central (MBTA station) → Boston University Central station
• Boston University East (MBTA station) → Boston University East station
• Boston University West (MBTA station) → Boston University West station
• Brandon Hall (MBTA station) → Brandon Hall station
• Brigham Circle (MBTA station) → Brigham Circle station
• Brookline Village (MBTA station) → Brookline Village station
• Bynner Street (MBTA station) → Bynner Street station
• Carolina Avenue (MBTA station) → Carolina Avenue station
• Chestnut Hill (MBTA station) → Chestnut Hill station (MBTA)
• Chestnut Hill Avenue (MBTA station) → Chestnut Hill Avenue station
• Child Street (MBTA station) → Child Street station
• Chiswick Road (MBTA station) → Chiswick Road station
• Cleveland Circle (MBTA station) → Cleveland Circle station
• College Avenue (MBTA station) → College Avenue station (MBTA)
• Coolidge Corner (MBTA station) → Coolidge Corner station
• Copley (MBTA station) → Copley station
• Dean Road (MBTA station) → Dean Road station
• Eliot (MBTA station) → Eliot station
• Englewood Avenue (MBTA station) → Englewood Avenue station
• Evergreen Street (MBTA station) → Evergreen Street station
• Fairbanks (MBTA station) → Fairbanks station
• Fenway (MBTA station) → Fenway station
• Fenwood Road (MBTA station) → Fenwood Road station
• Gilman Square (MBTA station) → Gilman Square station
• Griggs Street / Long Avenue (MBTA station) → Griggs Street/Long Avenue station
• Harvard Avenue (MBTA station) → Harvard Avenue station
• Hawes Street (MBTA station) → Hawes Street station
• Hynes Convention Center (MBTA station) → Hynes Convention Center station
• Kenmore (MBTA station) → Kenmore station
• Kent Street (MBTA station) → Kent Street station
• Lakeville Road (MBTA station) → Lakeville Road station
• Longwood (MBTA station) → Longwood station (MBTA)
• Longwood Medical Area (MBTA station) → Longwood Medical Area station
• Magoun Square (MBTA station) → Magoun Square station
• Mission Park (MBTA station) → Mission Park station
• Monument (MBTA station) → Monument station (MBTA)
• Moraine Street (MBTA station) → Moraine Street station
• Museum of Fine Arts (MBTA station) → Museum of Fine Arts station
• Newton Centre (MBTA station) → Newton Centre station (MBTA)
• Newton Corner (MBTA station) → Newton Corner station
• Newton Highlands (MBTA station) → Newton Highlands station (MBTA)
• Northeastern University (MBTA station) → Northeastern University station
• Oak Square (MBTA station) → Oak Square station
• Packards Corner (MBTA station) → Packards Corner station
• Perkins Street (MBTA station) → Perkins Street station
• Pleasant Street (MBTA station) → Pleasant Street station (MBTA)
• Pond Street (MBTA station) → Pond Street station
• Prudential (MBTA station) → Prudential station
• Reservoir (MBTA station) → Reservoir station (MBTA)
• Riverside (MBTA station) → Riverside station (MBTA)
• Riverway (MBTA station) → Riverway station
• Robinwood Avenue (MBTA station) → Robinwood Avenue station
• Route 16 (MBTA station) → Route 16 station
• Saint Rose Street (MBTA station) → Saint Rose Street station
• Science Park (MBTA station) → Science Park station (MBTA)
• Seaverns Avenue (MBTA station) → Seaverns Avenue station
• South Street (MBTA station) → South Street station (MBTA)
• St. Marys Street (MBTA station) → St. Marys Street station
• St. Paul Street (MBTA Green Line "B" Branch station) → St. Paul Street station (MBTA Green Line "B" Branch)
• St. Paul Street (MBTA Green Line "C" Branch station) → St. Paul Street station (MBTA Green Line "C" Branch)
• Summit Avenue (MBTA station) → Summit Avenue station (MBTA Green Line "C" Branch)
• Sutherland Road (MBTA station) → Sutherland Road station
• Symphony (MBTA station) → Symphony station
• Tappan Street (MBTA station) → Tappan Street station
• Union Square (MBTA Green Line "A" Branch station) → Union Square station (MBTA Green Line "A" Branch)
• Union Square (MBTA Green Line "E" Branch station) → Union Square station (MBTA Green Line "E" Branch)
• VA Medical Center (MBTA station) → VA Medical Center station (MBTA)
• Waban (MBTA station) → Waban station
• Warren Street (MBTA station) → Warren Street station (MBTA)
• Washington Square (MBTA station) → Washington Square station (MBTA)
• Washington Street (MBTA station) → Washington Street station (MBTA)
• Watertown Yard (MBTA station) → Watertown Yard (MBTA)
• Woodland (MBTA station) → Woodland station
• City Point (MBTA station) → City Point Bus Terminal
• Dudley Square (MBTA station) → Dudley Square station
• Herald Street (MBTA station) → Herald Street station
• Lenox Street (MBTA station) → Lenox Street station
• Melnea Cass Boulevard (MBTA station) → Melnea Cass Boulevard station
• Newton Street (MBTA station) → Newton Street station
• Silver Line Way (MBTA station) → Silver Line Way station
• Union Park Street (MBTA station) → Union Park Street station
• Worcester Square (MBTA station) → Worcester Square station
• World Trade Center (MBTA station) → World Trade Center station (MBTA)

– Per WP:USSTATION, stations without the need for disambiguation should be named "xxx station", and ones requiring it should be named "xxx station (disambiguator)". This list is in alphabetical order first of Category:Green Line (MBTA) stations, and then lists Category:Silver Line (MBTA) stations in alphabetical order. Daybeers (talk) 01:15, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Discussion

• Support as obvious and helpful. A few do need tweaking:
  • Babcock Street, Hawes Street, Newton Centre, Newton Highlands, Riverway, and Woodland (the other article is a redirect to a section of this one) shouldn't need disambiguation.
  • Washington Square may (or may not) need to be distinguished from West Fourth Street–Washington Square (New York City Subway). Washington (MBTA station) will very likely need reworking (which I can do) once the moves are done.
  • The two Union Square stations can probably be distinguished by geography since they're physically and temporally separated
  • Summit Avenue needs the same disambiguation as St. Paul Street to distinguish it from Summit Avenue (MBTA Green Line "B" Branch station) (which I plan to expand into an article someday). Its siblings Fordham Road (MBTA station), Greycliff Road (MBTA station), and Mount Hood Road (MBTA station) - the first of which will need disambiguation - should also be added to this list.
  • Boston University Central needs its suffix.
  • City Point should be City Point Bus Terminal per here
  • Watertown Yard doesn't need "station" at all - the article is really more about the yard than the station.
  • Griggs Street/Long Avenue shouldn't have spaces around the slash per the MOS.

Thanks for all your hard work in proposing this! Pi.1415926535 (talk) 01:47, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Gotcha. Should these be added/changed now? –Daybeers (talk) 01:57, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Yes, that's probably best. As proposer, you can make the judgement call on Washington Square. Cheers, Pi.1415926535 (talk) 02:04, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

After looking over your suggestions, I'd like to make a few notes.

I was inclined to add disambiguation to Newton Centre and Newton Highlands because articles exist at Newton Centre Railroad Station and Newton Highlands Railroad Station, both of which redirect to Newton Railroad Stations Historic District. Are those articles needed?

I decided to add disambiguation to Washington Square.

What do you suggest for geographical disambiguation for the two Union Square stations? Perhaps Union Square station (Boston) and Union Square station (Somerville, Massachusetts)?

Fordham Road, Greycliff Road, and Mount Hood Road shouldn't be moved because that would create a double redirect. New redirects can just be created at Fordham Road station (MBTA), Greycliff Road station, and Mount Hood Road station. The (very few) links to those articles can just be changed, and then the articles with the old disambiguation can be deleted.

The other points have been fixed. Thanks for the input! –Daybeers (talk) 02:57, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

@Pi.1415926535: Thoughts? I created the new redirects I named above. –Daybeers (talk) 02:32, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

Also, Kenmore Station is ambiguous with Cleveland.Theoallen1 (talk) 04:28, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

That's just because Kenmore station redirects to Kenmore station (GCRTA). Based on pageviews, Kenmore (MBTA station) is by far the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Moving shouldn't be a problem, since there are very few pages that actually link directly to Kenmore station. A hatnote can be added to both articles once moved. –Daybeers (talk) 04:37, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Fordham Road Station needs to be disambiguated, due to multiple NYC subway lines, Metro North, and MBTA.Theoallen1 (talk) 00:30, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

It doesn't have its own article, it's just a redirect to Green Line "B" Branch#Stop consolidation, but I moved it from Fordham Road (MBTA station) to Fordham Road station (MBTA). –Daybeers (talk) 02:32, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

• Support in general, with the assumption that nom and others will follow through with cleaning up any imperfections that result from the list. Dicklyon (talk) 04:59, 1 May 2018 (UTC)
• Support per WP:USSTATION, WP:COMMONNAME, and the naming criteria.--Cúchullain ^t/c 19:17, 1 May 2018 (UTC)
• Support. I don't see why we wouldn't follow the naming convention. Grk1011 (talk) 19:42, 1 May 2018 (UTC)
• Support. Clear-cut case of following local conventions and the WP:AT policy. —seav (talk) 00:10, 2 May 2018 (UTC)
• Support per USSTATION. I would also prefer that, for both the titles in this move as well as the titles that were previously moved, "XXX station (MBTA)" be redirected to "XXX station"-style titles in order to aid article navigation. epicgenius (talk) 00:19, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Timeline

{{Lechmere timeline}} is inaccessible and hard to parse even for a sighted person. What would be some better ways to convey this information? Mackensen (talk) 15:12, 28 April 2019 (UTC)

Agreed. The major service shifts - 1922, 1931, 1960s, and the chaos of the 1970s and 1980s - can probably be conveyed with a few sentences of prose, as can the handful of changes this century. We don't have to elaborate on every single service change, especially during the early MBTA years where they changed terminals frequently. I'm planning to write the full histories of the GLX and its stations at some point - probably when the station designs are 100% finalized later this year - and I'll definitely replace this timeline then if not sooner. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 02:08, 29 April 2019 (UTC)

Station status

@Pi.1415926535: Sorry, but I have to object to your changes to the article lede. The station still exists and is in service for the same customers, even though train service has been replaced by bus service at the present location. Yes, a new station is under construction and that should be mentioned early in the intro, but that is not the primary meaning of "Lechmere station" at the present time. It is still listed as a functioning station by the MBTA [1], which is of course a reliable source. I do not object to the photo of the under-construction station as the lede photo, as it is arguably more interesting than a couple of trains or buses and can be updated periodically to reflect progress.--agr (talk) 15:33, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

@ArnoldReinhold: I see your point, and I've rewritten the lede to balance the future and former stations. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 21:23, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Great, thanks.--agr (talk) 12:07, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

GA review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Lechmere station/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Sammi Brie (talk · contribs) 03:35, 10 August 2022 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
It is reasonably well written. a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists): It is factually accurate and verifiable. a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism): It is broad in its coverage. a (major aspects): b (focused): It follows the neutral point of view policy. Fair representation without bias: It is stable. No edit wars, etc.: It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate. a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall: Pass/Fail:
· · ·

Some copy changes, one minor issue with a source, and you'll be good to go. You might find more given how long it's been! 7-day hold. Ping me when done. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 04:26, 10 August 2022 (UTC)

Copy changes

Lead

• The surface station was closed on May 24, 2020 missing DATECOMMA
  •  Done

Station design

• The platform is 8 inches (200 mm) high for accessible boarding on current LRVs, and can be raised to 14 inches (360 mm)... — drop this comma, see User:Sammi Brie/Commas in sentences. Future errors of this type are denoted (C in S)
  •  Done

History

• north end of the viaduct, but rejected — remove comma (C in S)
  •  Done
• Unlike the Commonwealth Avenue, Beacon Street, and Huntington Avenue, the Cambridge Street and Bridge Street lines did not have dedicated medians, — consider adding "lines" after "Huntington Avenue"
  •  Done
• Question: is the Massachusetts Public Service Commission the same as the Massachusetts Public Utilities Commission or is that an error or something actually different?
  • It appears that the Utilities Commission replaced the Service Commission in 1919 - see here. I believe the names are correct for the time periods given.
• the construction rest of the terminal was already well underway. Is that a missing "of the" I see?
  •  Done
• Cambridge street — capitalize for consistency
  •  Done
• The new terminal was expected to be used by 24,000 passengers daily in each direction, and to increase daily seated capacity through the subway by 8,754 passengers. Drop comma (C in S)
  •  Done
• In 1924, the BERy indicated that Lechmere was "not fitted to be a permanent transfer station, and while being used as such must fail to satisfy", and recommended an extension to a larger transfer station. (C in S) I'd be fine with a comma here if we had "recommending" instead of "and recommended".
  • I'm inclined to keep the comma here; because there's a comma in the quote, the comma afterwards makes the sentence structure more clear. I think "recommended" is better to match "indicated".
• then follow — should be "then followed"
  •  Done
• This routing was deemed safer by the MBTA due to the fewer turns, though it was "extremely inconvenient to inbound passengers." — sentence fragment, so quote before period. See MOS:INOROUT
  •  Done
• for pedestrian from East Cambridge — pedestrians, plural
  •  Done
• the state begin planning — "began"
  •  Done
• as was elimination of the Union Square Branch and other cost reduction measures — "as were" plural subject
  •  Done
• , and 100% in October 2019 — remove comma (C in S)
  •  Done
• This was delayed in June 2021 to a December 2021 opening, and in October 2021 to a March 2022 opening — remove comma (C in S)

  Again, I'm inclined to keep the comma - without it, having four dates in close succession might be difficult to parse. I think the increased clarity outweighs the grammatical misdemeanor.

Source spot checks

I chose 12 of the 156 reference numbers at random for spot checks. All check out; one seems to need a bit of reconciling with the source.

• 30: Map - Description seems adequate.
• 33: Cambridge objection to loop track
• 39: Cost of elevated railway at $100,000
• 50: Mention of "improved waiting room facilities" in BERy report
• 63: Opening date (4/23/41) of parking lot
• 66: 1961 service changes
• 68: 1984 service changes due to line congestion (in footnote)
• 86: Inadequacy of streetcars, proposed line rerouting
• 103: Urban Ring fact sheet with "New Lechmere" as a station
• 114: 2012 signing of pact
• 117: One of two references for 2013 MassDOT contract award
• 148: April meeting mentions 5 of 9 central instrument houses installed (5, not 1, making it different from "a signal instrument house" mentioned in article)
  • Yeah, it's a bit confusing. Source 147, the April meeting page 19, specifically calls out the Lechmere house as being installed (and shows a photo). Source 148, the May meeting, mentioned 5 being installed but doesn't mention locations. I think "signal instrument house" is a good term to clarify that it's for the signal system; that phrase is used in the technical provisions (page 11.4-1 etc).

Other

• All images are appropriately licensed and have alt text. You know how to steal my heart!
  • Someday I'll manage to get alt text added to the GA criteria!
• References aren't archived, but I remember from reviewing Green Line Extension that this is your personal choice, so I'm not going to require it here.
• Earwig catches names of organizations and things like "Green Line Northwest Corridor"; no significant issues.

Review in progress

@Sammi Brie: Thanks for the detailed review! I've fixed most of the items you've commented on, and replied to the remaining few. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 23:09, 10 August 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 12:09, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

• ... that Lechmere station was proposed for replacement in 1924 – yet was in use until 2020? Source: annual report for 1923, closure announcement
  • ALT1: ... that a 1924 report said Lechmere station would "fail to satisfy" as a transfer station, but it remained in use until 2020? Source: annual report for 1923, closure announcement
  • ALT2: ... that a 1978 plan for Lechmere station called for a 200-foot-wide (61 m) deck with both bus and rail loops? Source: Lechmere Canal and Triangle Area Development Project
  • ALT3: ... that Lechmere station was future-proofed with a longer-than-needed platform to avoid a difficult modification later? Source: technical provisions page 12.1-5 (page 389 of the PDF)
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Rodney Parker

Created by Pi.1415926535 (talk). Self-nominated at 06:11, 12 August 2022 (UTC).

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Cited: Interesting:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Looks great! I prefer ALT0 personally. paul2520 💬 22:06, 15 August 2022 (UTC)